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Saturated Fat is not the major issue

bmj.com

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Re: Saturated Fat is not the major issue

#51

Post by adamconroy »

artichokeheart wrote: post #29
cam_l wrote: post #20

Good response to this article with, like, facts and that.. http://theconversation.com/its-not-even-debatable-saturated-...

Such a shame that the author apparently didn't read all of the linked "facts". eg. "This cause and effect is now beyond reasonable doubt; science shows ( http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8043072 ) that high levels of cholesterol cause arterial damage and this, in turn, causes coronary heart disease." The linked paper and the comments to that paper disputing the findings completely contradicts the author's "beyond r…

The problem with the 'science' is that the main study done on this topic cherry picked the countries it included in the results and excluded some 20 countries. If you only is d data from the excluded countries you would find the reverse correlation. One has to be very careful to look out for confirmation bias in research.

Re: Saturated Fat is not the major issue

#52

Post by auctiontheory »

arunc wrote: post #49

Am I the only one to see a trend in the increasing number of articles like these? Traditionally for centuries people in India have been consuming coconut oil, ghee, etc which are supposed to be high in saturated fats and never had problems. After globalization (1992), the food industry in here changed a lot as well. The business promotion and the usage of refined oils increased which is good for business, nevertheles…

Diabetes and heart disease were widespread in India long before 1992. A simpler explanation, over the last century, is that Indians are eating more, and exercising less (i.e. not in the fields).

Aloo curry over white rice - nothing healthy about that, whatever oil you use to cook it in.

Re: Saturated Fat is not the major issue

#53

Post by JunkDNA »

droopyEyelids wrote: post #43
JunkDNA wrote: post #27

About 10 years ago the journal "Science" ran a cover story called "The soft Science of Dietary fat". If you have access to back issues through a library (sadly it's paywalled), go pull it and read it. Your mind will be blown at how thin the evidence is for many dietary recommendations. We know shockingly little about how our bodies actually work.

Is this what you're talking about? http://garytaubes.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/Science-The...

Yes, that's it. If I recall there were multiple pieces in that issue about various aspects, but this was the primary one.

Re: Saturated Fat is not the major issue

#54

Post by elrzn »

Volpe wrote: post #22
wwweston wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nothing bad is going to happen by reducing saturated fat intake From what I've read, it depends on what you eat instead. For example, as the article says: "a JAMA study revealed that a 'low fat' diet showed the greatest decrease in energy expenditure, an unhealthy lipid pattern, and increased insulin resistance (a precursor to diabetes) compared with a low carbohydrate and low glycaemic index (GI) diet."

Insulin resistance is caused by sugar intake (completely unrelated to cholesterol)... Arguing that in order to lower cholesterol you have to consume more sugar seems rather strange.

How is that? My understanding is that lipid oxidation promotes insulin resistance itself.

If anything, and under the right dosage, sugar is protective.

Re: Saturated Fat is not the major issue

#55

Post by Crake »

malkia wrote: post #34
Volpe wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But I've seen no evidence that, that is what happened. There doesn't seem to be a logical reason as to why you'd need to increase sugar in order to lower cholesterol, so why would companies do that? Can you point to an example food(s) that had high fat, and low sugar, and then after this policy, low fat, and high sugar... ?

Maybe to make the food still tasty. Go to your local store - check all low-fat, 2%-enters, etc. and then full milk - check the sugar content percentage. That's all... At least here in US, Los Angeles - usually it's the normal yogurt/milk (e.g. hihg-fat) that has lower sugary content (percentage-wise) than the rest. Sometimes it's quite significantly lower. And I don't know how the whole craze about non-plain yogurt c…

I'm American and it took me until last year to learn that yogurt isn't sweet by default. 95% of the grocery store offerings are the sugary kind, and that's all I was ever exposed to as a kid, so I never noticed it. I spent years thinking I hated yogurt only to eventually discover that the unsweetened kind is really delicious. D:

Re: Saturated Fat is not the major issue

#56

Post by Crake »

wwweston wrote: post #8

A related pet peeve: It's becoming difficult to find products with "all" the fat (vs "low/reduced" fat). Prime example for me: chocolate milk. It's pretty rare nowadays that I ever see anything over 1% milk used in it -- and of course the label touts the low fat formulation, but doesn't mention there's more sugar pumped in it than a can of soda. Even if this was healthier than full-fat/less sugar chocolate milk, I'd…

I HATE 1% MILK. gdsgnf,dhjghld

I also really dislike sweet things, so I'm with you 100% on the rest of the content too. I'd probably like chocolate milk if it weren't so nauseatingly sugary.

Re: Saturated Fat is not the major issue

#57

Post by eniacpx »

dools wrote: post #18
mirsadm wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the biggest issue is that high (saturated) fat is often combined with high carb (refined sugars, starchy foods etc). My diet consists of high fat / low carb foods and it simply works (for me...). I've lost weight (without trying) and my energy levels are much more predictable and stable. I never watch how much I eat because my body will naturally stop be from overeating.

I found that "mentally" what worked for me was focusing on increasing fibre intake, rather than reducing sugar intake. The effect is basically the same but I find it easier from a discipline perspective to focus on including more high fibre foods (even in "treats" and dessert foods) thank I do to "cut out" things that I enjoy.

I agree, I lost a load of weight doing this. I still eat treats but I make them with whole wheat flour and I typically reduce the sugar content as well.

Re: Saturated Fat is not the major issue

#58

Post by vonmoltke »

Volpe wrote: post #24
scotch_drinker wrote: post #11

There have been a lot of people saying this for quite awhile. Malcolm Kendrick wrote an entire book about the poor science behind our current belief that cholesterol causes heart disease. There are many others. But in the current medical environment where doctors want to prescribe a pill to fix everything and the biogen companies have enormous influence over public policy, dissent never rises above the level of a whi…

Those with higher cholesterol have a higher percentage of heart attacks. Doctors (in Australia at least) prescribe when your risk (calculated on your cholesterol, smoking, stress, exercise, etc) is lowered by reducing your cholesterol, and dietary restriction hasn't worked (i.e. your liver just isn't as good as it used to be). Is that not how its done in the U.S?

Not usually, no. Here, doctors usually reach for the script pad as soon as an issue with blood pressure, cholesterol, or such is detected, THEN work on the dietary and lifestyle changes to get the patient off the drugs.

Re: Saturated Fat is not the major issue

#59

Post by swombat »

voidlogic wrote: post #41
mistermann wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps their lobbyists aren't as convincing. This is the second time I've encountered the phrase "lacks predictive power on HN tonight" by the way. Is a theory without predictive power now considered wrong?

IMHO if it doesn't have predictive power it cannot be a theory: the·o·ry noun \ˈthē-ə-rē, ˈthir-ē\ : an idea or set of ideas that is intended to explain facts or events

Explanation and prediction are two different things.

Your definition doesn't even require explanation - it just requires intent to explain.

So for example, "the moon is made of cheese" is a theory according to the definition you just quoted. It's an idea that is intended to explain the composition of the moon.

Re: Saturated Fat is not the major issue

#60

Post by femto »

femto wrote: post #25

"Catalyst", the ABC's weekly science show, had an interesting investigation into this last Thursday [1]. Last week was Part I, which presumably means this week will be Part II. [1] http://www.abc.net.au/catalyst/stories/3876219.htm --- Edit: Wed->Thu

Followup: Last week's program is generating some heat, with calls for the next installment not to be shown. The ABC plans on showing it.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-10-28/professor-says-abc-cat...

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