Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves' • Hacker News Board

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#51

Post by nether » Wed, Sep 25, 2013, 7:39 PM UTC

jlgreco wrote: post #2

From the article: • Evidence of forced labour on a huge World Cup infrastructure project. • Some Nepalese men have alleged that they have not been paid for months and have had their salaries retained to stop them running away. • Some workers on other sites say employers routinely confiscate passports and refuse to issue ID cards, in effect reducing them to the status of illegal aliens. • Some labourers say they have…

> I have to object to The Guardian's use of scare quotes in the title...

I don't think this is scare quotes, more like conservative British journalism that handles any story-relevant term delicately by emphasizing it's a quotation, and not their interpretation. I've seen it lots in the BBC: https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&gl=us&tbm=nws&authuser=0...

'emits flammable gas'

'played dead'

'bad habits'

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#52

Post by nether » Wed, Sep 25, 2013, 7:40 PM UTC

jlgreco wrote: post #9

wnevets wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like modern day slavery to me

That is exactly what it is. The author and/or editor should have had a spine and made the headline: "Revealed: Qatar's World Cup slaves"

You're ascribing American notions of journalism to a British paper. They are not scare quotes.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#53

Post by shardling » Wed, Sep 25, 2013, 7:41 PM UTC

jlgreco wrote: post #2

From the article: • Evidence of forced labour on a huge World Cup infrastructure project. • Some Nepalese men have alleged that they have not been paid for months and have had their salaries retained to stop them running away. • Some workers on other sites say employers routinely confiscate passports and refuse to issue ID cards, in effect reducing them to the status of illegal aliens. • Some labourers say they have…

>I have to object to The Guardian's use of scare quotes in the title...

I've noticed it's quite standard in English publications to use quotes around allegations, even if no one really believes the other side.

Not sure if this is just custom, or something to do with the stricter libel laws...

e: Here is a post on the language log that goes into the matter. (Make sure to read the comments.)

http://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=1017

Comment from a headline writer: http://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=1017#comment-18782

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#54

Post by tinyProton » Wed, Sep 25, 2013, 7:45 PM UTC

vowelless wrote: post #19

As referenced to in the article and highly relevant, the Kafala System [1] which has roots in Islamic adoption jurisprudence [2]. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kafala_system [2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_adoptional_jurisprudenc...

Even though these two share the same Arabic noun: 'kafala', they actually refers to two totally different things. One refers to the migrant laborers monitoring system, while the other refers to the Islamic view of child adoption. Don't mix them up. The 'kafala' system has no relation (or share roots) with the meaning of 'kafala' in Islam. It's nothing but a name of the legislation of migrant laborers.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#55

Post by jlgreco » Wed, Sep 25, 2013, 7:46 PM UTC

nether wrote: post #51

jlgreco wrote: post #2

From the article: • Evidence of forced labour on a huge World Cup infrastructure project. • Some Nepalese men have alleged that they have not been paid for months and have had their salaries retained to stop them running away. • Some workers on other sites say employers routinely confiscate passports and refuse to issue ID cards, in effect reducing them to the status of illegal aliens. • Some labourers say they have…

> I have to object to The Guardian's use of scare quotes in the title... I don't think this is scare quotes, more like conservative British journalism that handles any story-relevant term delicately by emphasizing it's a quotation, and not their interpretation. I've seen it lots in the BBC: https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&gl=us&tbm=nws&authuser=0... 'emits flammable gas' 'played dead' 'bad habits'

Ah okay, that makes more sense. I tentatively revoke my criticism of the author and/or editor if that's what is going on here.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#56

Post by linux_devil » Wed, Sep 25, 2013, 7:49 PM UTC

Can't imagine to walk in their shoes. This is a crime and serious human right violation. Wonder if embassy of small country not able to take action against contractors?

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#57

Post by 404error » Wed, Sep 25, 2013, 7:55 PM UTC

peter_l_downs wrote: post #49

rayiner wrote: post #44

It pains me that the U.S. has absolutely no balls to stand up to the Middle Eastern sheikdoms. And American businessmen are slobbering like puppies trying to get a slice of that oil capital. It's all quite disgusting really.

Why would the US be involved in this issue? I would think that it's FIFA's fault for choosing the location.

IMO you are spot on that its FIFA's fault for choosing the location. The Cup will be moved to the winter and will affect European football due to league play.

The US was runner up and should have been awarded the World Cup in 2022. The 1994 Cup in the US was one of the most, it not the most, profitable World Cup.

The infrastructure is in place in the US to host the World Cup.

Can you imagine what political ramifications there would be if the World Cup hosting rights were taking away from Qatar and awarded to the US.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#58

Post by mratzloff » Wed, Sep 25, 2013, 7:56 PM UTC

yapcguy wrote: post #31

vowelless wrote: post #19

As referenced to in the article and highly relevant, the Kafala System [1] which has roots in Islamic adoption jurisprudence [2]. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kafala_system [2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_adoptional_jurisprudenc...

Wow, only 6% of the labor force is made up of locals. Basically the Qataris sit back and let workers from the rest of the world do 94% of the country's work. Which begs the question, what exactly do Qataris do all day?! >"Under the state-run kafala sponsorship system, workers are also unable to change jobs or leave the country without their sponsor company's permission." (Guardian) > About 1.2 million foreign workers…

> Which begs the question, what exactly do Qataris do all day?!

Get paid by the government.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#59

Post by baddox » Wed, Sep 25, 2013, 7:56 PM UTC

nether wrote: post #51

jlgreco wrote: post #2

From the article: • Evidence of forced labour on a huge World Cup infrastructure project. • Some Nepalese men have alleged that they have not been paid for months and have had their salaries retained to stop them running away. • Some workers on other sites say employers routinely confiscate passports and refuse to issue ID cards, in effect reducing them to the status of illegal aliens. • Some labourers say they have…

> I have to object to The Guardian's use of scare quotes in the title... I don't think this is scare quotes, more like conservative British journalism that handles any story-relevant term delicately by emphasizing it's a quotation, and not their interpretation. I've seen it lots in the BBC: https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&gl=us&tbm=nws&authuser=0... 'emits flammable gas' 'played dead' 'bad habits'

That seems to be the case here, although it's slightly more confusing (to me, an American reader) when it's only a single word in quotation marks.

Re: Revealed: Qatar's World Cup 'slaves'

#60

Post by philwelch » Wed, Sep 25, 2013, 8:02 PM UTC

Qatar's 2022 World Cup is a major controversy even outside of this. FIFA accepts World Cup bids mainly on the basis of bribery, but Qatar was a bridge too far. The country is so unsuitable to host a World Cup while simultaneously being so full of money that's being spent chasing prestige that it's completely blatant what really happened there.

The temperature is over 100 in the summer, so even with massive air conditioned stadiums they're not sure how to build yet, it's going to be a miserable experience for fans. If they move it to the winter, that means either January/February (which conflicts with the Winter Olympics and, in the US, the NFL postseason, leaving FOX aggrieved that their World Cup broadcasting rights are essentially worthless) or November/December (which conflicts with club football in England, particularly the traditional Boxing Day fixtures). Australia, one of the other countries that bid for 2022, is threatening to sue FIFA if they move the tournament to winter on the grounds that they bid for a summer tournament. The USA also had a very strong 2022 bid. Qatar, like Russia (who will host the 2018 World Cup) also has laws against homosexuality. The Russia bid, by the way, won against an England bid, and while it's more defensible than Qatar, it also smells of bribery and does more to motivate England in particular against FIFA's handling of the next two World Cup bidding processes.

With all that in context, this frankly isn't news. Qatar, like Dubai, is notorious for its treatment of migrant construction labor. But stories like this serve a PR purpose for the multitudes of parties aggrieved by FIFA, all of whom have money on the line.