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Documents Shed Light on Border Laptop Searches

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Re: Documents Shed Light on Border Laptop Searches

#51

Post by aplusbi »

fooqux wrote: post #44
aplusbi wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then change your password to something that you don't actually know. Generate a random password before your trip and print out a few copies. Take one with you and secure the remaining ones. Before you fly through the UK, change the password on your computer to the random one and destroy the printout. When you get back home use the remaining printouts to change your password back and then destroy them.

These sorts of techniques make great comments, but are nearly useless in reality. First of all, even if you're being truthful, saying "I don't know my password" will likely not be believed. Explaining the process you went through to safeguard your password will merely elicit suspicion by a border agent. Why would you go through such pains if you had nothing to hide? And once they are suspicious of you, you will almos…

The assumption is that you are okay with having your laptop seized.

Obviously the best approach is to just not have your laptop.

Re: Documents Shed Light on Border Laptop Searches

#52

Post by aplusbi »

grey-area wrote: post #45
aplusbi wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then change your password to something that you don't actually know. Generate a random password before your trip and print out a few copies. Take one with you and secure the remaining ones. Before you fly through the UK, change the password on your computer to the random one and destroy the printout. When you get back home use the remaining printouts to change your password back and then destroy them.

I haven't studied this law in detail, but it expect it is worded to avoid precisely this sort of manoeuvre, because the implication is quite clear - you have no right to privacy. If necessary they'd just confiscate your device and detain you on suspicion of perverting the course of justice etc, etc. they can hold you for 3 months for refusing to answer any questions they ask, including questions on your encryption sc…

I haven't studied this law either, but look at what happened to David Miranda who was in a situation very similar to the one I proposed - he was transporting information but didn't know what he was carrying (and given the people involved, the hard drives were probably encrypted).

He was detained for 9 hours and threatened with arrest during that time, but this was under terrorism laws, not encryption laws. And ultimately he was let go (sans equipment).

Re: Documents Shed Light on Border Laptop Searches

#53

Post by recursive »

fooqux wrote: post #44
aplusbi wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then change your password to something that you don't actually know. Generate a random password before your trip and print out a few copies. Take one with you and secure the remaining ones. Before you fly through the UK, change the password on your computer to the random one and destroy the printout. When you get back home use the remaining printouts to change your password back and then destroy them.

These sorts of techniques make great comments, but are nearly useless in reality. First of all, even if you're being truthful, saying "I don't know my password" will likely not be believed. Explaining the process you went through to safeguard your password will merely elicit suspicion by a border agent. Why would you go through such pains if you had nothing to hide? And once they are suspicious of you, you will almos…

FYI elicit

Re: Documents Shed Light on Border Laptop Searches

#54

Post by Torgo »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #23
chiph wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even with full-disk encryption, an image will be made of the drive, and the government will keep a copy on the chance that the password will be revealed later. Or the algorithm gets broken/weak enough at some point in the future.

Silly question. Let's assume you have a device like a Macbook Pro or a Macbook Air, where you can't physically remove the drive without ungluing the device. You hotrod the firmware so only trusted USB devices with a specific encryption key are permitted to connect. How would the drive be imaged?

It's too bad the newer Macbook Pros don't come with ExpressCard slots anymore. I used to boot off a fast SSD expresscard. No disadvantages at all, other than the card ran hot. Remove the internal drive and when you pop out the Expresscard, much lower attack surface.

Re: Documents Shed Light on Border Laptop Searches

#55

Post by ensignavenger »

grey-area wrote: post #45
aplusbi wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then change your password to something that you don't actually know. Generate a random password before your trip and print out a few copies. Take one with you and secure the remaining ones. Before you fly through the UK, change the password on your computer to the random one and destroy the printout. When you get back home use the remaining printouts to change your password back and then destroy them.

I haven't studied this law in detail, but it expect it is worded to avoid precisely this sort of manoeuvre, because the implication is quite clear - you have no right to privacy. If necessary they'd just confiscate your device and detain you on suspicion of perverting the course of justice etc, etc. they can hold you for 3 months for refusing to answer any questions they ask, including questions on your encryption sc…

Does the UK not have anything similar to the 5th Amendment in the US? Could they ask you "Did you still a hot dog from that hotdog stand"? And force you to confess, or be faced with charges of lying to an officer?

Re: Documents Shed Light on Border Laptop Searches

#56

Post by grey-area »

aplusbi wrote: post #52
grey-area wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't studied this law in detail, but it expect it is worded to avoid precisely this sort of manoeuvre, because the implication is quite clear - you have no right to privacy. If necessary they'd just confiscate your device and detain you on suspicion of perverting the course of justice etc, etc. they can hold you for 3 months for refusing to answer any questions they ask, including questions on your encryption sc…

I haven't studied this law either, but look at what happened to David Miranda who was in a situation very similar to the one I proposed - he was transporting information but didn't know what he was carrying (and given the people involved, the hard drives were probably encrypted). He was detained for 9 hours and threatened with arrest during that time, but this was under terrorism laws, not encryption laws. And ultima…

People have been jailed in the uk for not giving up their password. I suspect Miranda was released because they had the devices/data and had made their point, plus of course it would have become a major international incident given the news organisations involved and their involvement in the story. If he didn't have embassy staff and the guardian lawyers demanding his release, it might never have happened.

Re: Documents Shed Light on Border Laptop Searches

#58

Post by grey-area »

ensignavenger wrote: post #55
grey-area wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't studied this law in detail, but it expect it is worded to avoid precisely this sort of manoeuvre, because the implication is quite clear - you have no right to privacy. If necessary they'd just confiscate your device and detain you on suspicion of perverting the course of justice etc, etc. they can hold you for 3 months for refusing to answer any questions they ask, including questions on your encryption sc…

Does the UK not have anything similar to the 5th Amendment in the US? Could they ask you "Did you still a hot dog from that hotdog stand"? And force you to confess, or be faced with charges of lying to an officer?

Under normal law, yes there is a right to remain silent, at the border, no, because they have passed laws (schedule 7 of the 2000 terror act) saying they can imprison you for three months if you fail to cooperate in any way or answer any questions.

Re: Documents Shed Light on Border Laptop Searches

#59

Post by chris_mahan »

betterunix wrote: post #34
chris_mahan wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

don't store ssh keys.

SSH keys need to be stored somewhere if they are to be useful. Perhaps the safest bet is to move the keys to a smartcard, carry that with you while you travel, then destroy the card before re-entering the USA.

I don't store ssh keys. I remember the (long) passwords.
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