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Hospital creates bidding war by posting pricing online

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Re: Hospital creates bidding war by posting pricing online

#51

Post by ahallock »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #28
ry0ohki wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>There is no such thing as a rational demand side, as you don't get to choose if you need healthcare or not That's not true in many cases. I bump my head or get a sore throat, I can choose to seek medical treatment or not. There are also lots of things like "yearly checkups", etc...

Fine. Sure, you bump your head or get a sore throat, you walk it off. What happens when you try to "walk off" something you think is minor, and you're in the ER 24-72 hours later? Hello $20K-$50K bill. My wife and I were in a car accident a year ago (someone turned in front of us while we were doing 40mph). My wife required an ambulance for transportation due to damage to her right foot. The ambulance didn't exactly…

That's what insurance is for. Catastrophic situations. Or perhaps there's a way to pre-purchase emergency care at a discount. Or you set your emergency provider ahead of time based on price. I don't know. There must be creative ways to solve this problem rather than being all fatalist about it.

Re: Hospital creates bidding war by posting pricing online

#52

Post by zdean »

easyfrag wrote: post #34

One thing to keep in mind is that there's more to good medical care than a fair price: Post-op infection rate - do all clinical employees regularly wash their hands before and after each patient encounter? Re-admission rate - does the institution or surgeon do enough cases of a particular procedure to be proficient? Error Rate - Are pre-op checklists ALWAYS used? Post-op care - Are supportive therapies like Physiothe…

Actually, a 'fair price' would be reflective of all of these factors. If a hospital/health provider feels that it excels in these areas, then they could just as well publish these quantifiable measures along with their prices. Then it's up to the consumer to decide how valuable these factors are to them. However, there's no reason to assume that the hospital that's charging 1/4 what others are charging is demonstrably inferior in any of these ways just because of the price.

Re: Hospital creates bidding war by posting pricing online

#53

Post by antitrust »

easyfrag wrote: post #34

One thing to keep in mind is that there's more to good medical care than a fair price: Post-op infection rate - do all clinical employees regularly wash their hands before and after each patient encounter? Re-admission rate - does the institution or surgeon do enough cases of a particular procedure to be proficient? Error Rate - Are pre-op checklists ALWAYS used? Post-op care - Are supportive therapies like Physiothe…

Adding to your comment:

There's a lot that cannot be quantified as well.

For example, some doctors I trust more than others because I think their diagnostic skills, empathy, listening skills and ability to absorb case knowledge are superior to the generalized level of their peers' abilities in the same area.

However, I wouldn't want someone to make an Excel spreadsheet with every patient's assessment of his/her doctor in the same way, since I think most patient's judgment skills will be on a similar standardized level that is below what I would need.

It's sort of like martial arts fighters. We can measure number of wins/losses at tournaments, but we can't assess how well they'd do when approaching an unknown situation with assailants who do not play by the rules.

Re: Hospital creates bidding war by posting pricing online

#55

Post by fnordfnordfnord »

Vivtek wrote: post #4
HarryHirsch wrote: post #3

This happens only now ? In more civilized countries like Germany, prices for procedures have been set since time immorial. There is a provision for surcharges from the physician, but these aren't common, and the physician will have to have a good cause or the insurer will not pay it. Same thing for new medications: they are not permitted in the clinic unless there is a genuine advantage for the patient. All this is o…

Sure. "Give me all your money or you die" is a guaranteed profit.

"Give me all your money AND you die" is also a popular scheme.

I'm glad to see another chip in the the foundation of these business models.

Re: Hospital creates bidding war by posting pricing online

#56

Post by drawkbox »

HarryHirsch wrote: post #25
ambiate wrote: post #14

I dream of a day when I can walk into an area which offers 'services' and be offered a pricing chart. From hospitals, banks, loan officers, home loans, cars, etc. A cryptic itemized list, such as a mortgage's Good Faith Estimate (GFE), which falls short of describing the items in the list still fails my test. This hope is not for me. Its for the misfortunate who run on impulse and have weak mathematical logic. Many p…

> I dream of a day when I can walk into an area which offers 'services' and be offered a pricing chart. I don't want to be offered a pricing chart when I have a kidney stone or get violently mugged. When that happens I don't want to have to deal with that sort of thing. The free market in medicine is plain weird. Everyone needs the doctor on occasion, and everyone needs tyres on their car. Both things are pretty stan…

I like prices before the service, even health. I think the not knowing the price aspect keeps many people from services they need and makes people do services they might not need based on not knowing the price.

To live in a capitalist society and accept a service without knowing the cost is a bit scary and stressful. Yes it is your health and must be paid attention but so is maintenance on your house and vehicles and you'd never agree to some service on your house or vehicle for its health without knowing the price. You want at least an estimate before going through with it with that provider.

Contractors for repairs around the house as an example, they vary in quality and price, it is better to make a smart decision than one that is brash and payment is determined after the fact. Granted health costs are harder to predict and extremely important but the added stress of not knowing the cost I think is actually bad for health.

Re: Hospital creates bidding war by posting pricing online

#57

Post by alexholehouse »

Great story but

"OKLAHOMA CITY – An Oklahoma City surgery center is offering a new kind of price transparency, posting guaranteed all-inclusive surgery prices online. The move is revolutionizing medical billing in Oklahoma and around the world."

Around the world? Really?

Re: Hospital creates bidding war by posting pricing online

#58

Post by homosaur »

easyfrag wrote: post #34

One thing to keep in mind is that there's more to good medical care than a fair price: Post-op infection rate - do all clinical employees regularly wash their hands before and after each patient encounter? Re-admission rate - does the institution or surgeon do enough cases of a particular procedure to be proficient? Error Rate - Are pre-op checklists ALWAYS used? Post-op care - Are supportive therapies like Physiothe…

Of course they are commodities, and of course it would increase demand, I don't know why you would suggest otherwise. It might not be like pricing blenders and there are other considerations but there's no reason to think that this wouldn't affect the market positively for buyers. You're ignoring the largest single market which would benefit from public pricing and lowered rates, the uninsured. It doesn't matter to you because you throw your insurance card up there and someone else pays the bill but if someone knew a colonoscopy was $X then they could budget for that and pursue competitive options.

Plus, the things you mentioned have little to nothing to do with pricing. There's plenty of shit hospitals that charge outrageous fees. Just look at Texas. It doesn't take more money to engage in proper sanitation, it takes good management. These are two separate issues entirely.

Re: Hospital creates bidding war by posting pricing online

#59

Post by homosaur »

etler wrote: post #10

Can you call transparent pricing a "revolution" when the status quo is purposefully obfuscated and archaic in order to nickle and dime you? It seems more like just doing the right thing.

Can you call desegregation revolutionary since it was just "doing the right thing?"

In a corrupt market or system, doing the right thing is in and of itself a revolutionary act. Doctors standing up for what's right instead of their pocketbook and pharma reps is a revolutionary act.

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