Live data from Hacker News

Vipassana Trip Report by Rap Genius Founder

rapgenius.com

51–58 of 58 posts

Re: Vipassana Trip Report by Rap Genius Founder

#51
post #36

What is the practice of meditation taught there, and what result in a human life do they have if they practice the meditation?

Vipassana. The "western" name of the meditation practice is generally given as insight or mindfulness meditation. In terms of benefits, consider meditation a tool to understand your mind and to be better able to understand your drives and motivations, and to learn how to focus your attention on various aspects of yourself. What "result" you get from that depends very much on you and your motivations and desires, but…

> In terms of benefits, consider meditation a tool to understand your mind and to be better able to understand your drives and motivations, and to learn how to focus your attention on various aspects of yourself. What "result" you get from that depends very much on you and your motivations and desires, but what I feel I get from it is a stronger appreciation of the world around me, better concentration, and better impulse control.

You said that it's a tool which can accomplish better understanding. Did you become to understand your mind and what causes you have? You say you have concentration but I'd like to confirm what you can see with your concentration.

In the world, an answer is determined by a question. Like in math, 1 + 1 is a problem that makes the result 2 according to a fixed formula. If someone finds 1 or 3 from the question then it's either their mistake in calculation or the causes (numbers in question) were misreported.

Re: Vipassana Trip Report by Rap Genius Founder

#52
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vipassana. The "western" name of the meditation practice is generally given as insight or mindfulness meditation. In terms of benefits, consider meditation a tool to understand your mind and to be better able to understand your drives and motivations, and to learn how to focus your attention on various aspects of yourself. What "result" you get from that depends very much on you and your motivations and desires, but…

> better concentration, and better impulse control. I have not done a 10 day sit as described in TFA, but I've had a passably regular Vipassana-style meditation practice for a few years now, and concentration and impulse control have been two major benefits in my life. One thing that comes with impulse control, but I find valuable enough to merit mentioning on its own, is that I am now much better at letting go of th…

When you say letting go of thoughts, how can you differentiate between getting rid of attachments, and abandoning yourself by giving up the questions you have inside?

Re: Vipassana Trip Report by Rap Genius Founder

#53
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vipassana. The "western" name of the meditation practice is generally given as insight or mindfulness meditation. In terms of benefits, consider meditation a tool to understand your mind and to be better able to understand your drives and motivations, and to learn how to focus your attention on various aspects of yourself. What "result" you get from that depends very much on you and your motivations and desires, but…

> In terms of benefits, consider meditation a tool to understand your mind and to be better able to understand your drives and motivations, and to learn how to focus your attention on various aspects of yourself. What "result" you get from that depends very much on you and your motivations and desires, but what I feel I get from it is a stronger appreciation of the world around me, better concentration, and better im…

Concentration is an ability to remain focused on something. It does not have "results" other than the ability to retain that focus for a longer period of time or with fewer distractions.

In terms of understanding my mind, you seem to be very focused on absolute, objective outcomes. It is not that simple. What questions would you ask? And how would you measure the outcomes?

A lot of questions you might ask can only be evaluated by answers your own mind gives you, and you often can't tell if those answers are objectively correct or just rationalizations.

What you can do is observe what you feel (physical sensations, or internal feelings), how you react, what you think, what brings out specific thoughts etc. and try to bring more of your actions under conscious scrutiny and control.

To go back to my example about impulse control and chocolate: If my mind tells me I deserve that chocolate, is it right or wrong? There is no objective truth to that, because the only arbiter is myself, and if there are rules that says I shouldn't have chocolate, they are rules I set myself and rules I am allowed to change.

What meditation as a tool helps with in situations like that, is teach you techniques to "catch" your mind in the act of rationalizations to let you slow down and consciously evaluate those thoughts before accepting them. Instead of accepting that "yes, I deserve that chocolate", I might think "hold on, I have decided to diet; I can have that chocolate, but I'll feel disappointed later that I had it". Or I might go "yes, I do actually deserve that chocolate; I've done very well on that diet, and as long as it is just that one chocolate, it is an acceptable trade off". Neither decision is still correct or incorrect.

It might feel trite and underwhelming, but we tend to walk through our lives following hundreds of impulses a day that we don't question, or even are aware of: We go one route instead of another to get somewhere. We pick one outfit instead of another. We pick certain meals. We say certain things instead of others. We smile at someone, or ignore them.

A lot of the time there are explanations for these actions that are plain as day if you pay attention. You can go through your life oblivious to the reasons, and thus not influence them consciously. Or you can pay more attention and more consciously decide which decisions to take.

The latter is not more correct. But in my experience it feels more rewarding, as I am often able to catch impulses for me to act in ways that counteract goals that I have set myself, and change my behaviour.

One thing I noticed, for example, was how I'd impulsively do small things avoid people to reduce social interactions with people I didn't know well. This at the same time as I was trying to improve my social skills. Consciously paying attention helped me catch those impulses as they were happening and override them.

Re: Vipassana Trip Report by Rap Genius Founder

#54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> better concentration, and better impulse control. I have not done a 10 day sit as described in TFA, but I've had a passably regular Vipassana-style meditation practice for a few years now, and concentration and impulse control have been two major benefits in my life. One thing that comes with impulse control, but I find valuable enough to merit mentioning on its own, is that I am now much better at letting go of th…

When you say letting go of thoughts, how can you differentiate between getting rid of attachments, and abandoning yourself by giving up the questions you have inside?

What is the real you?

To me, getting rid of attachments means to reduce the impulses that controls my actions "behind my back". It does not mean not caring, but it means noticing that you care, and noticing how that feels, and noticing what the impulses tell you, and then making a decision based on that information rather than just blindly following the impulses.

Often that means acting differently than the impulses tells you because you recognize that other goals you have are better served by not giving in.

Personally I don't believe that means I am abandoning myself, but on the contrary that I am living up to my belief of who I am and who I should be much better by (slowly) ridding myself of compulsions that made (and makes) me unhappy by getting me to act in ways inconsistent with how I want to be.

A lot of human pain and frustration is down to the inconsistencies of self - how we want to do that coding, but end up procrastinating all day and then afterwards feels guilty about it, for example. Maybe that procrastination was nice, and good for us. But we (or I am at least) are happier when we actively make that choice.

I still don't believe I am good at it, but I hope I keep getting better at it.

Re: Vipassana Trip Report by Rap Genius Founder

#55
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you say letting go of thoughts, how can you differentiate between getting rid of attachments, and abandoning yourself by giving up the questions you have inside?

What is the real you? To me, getting rid of attachments means to reduce the impulses that controls my actions "behind my back". It does not mean not caring, but it means noticing that you care, and noticing how that feels, and noticing what the impulses tell you, and then making a decision based on that information rather than just blindly following the impulses. Often that means acting differently than the impulses…

To be certain, I'm asking happimess how he differentiates between consciously removing an attachment, and abandoning the problems before solving them.

You said, "etting rid of attachments means to reduce the impulses that controls my actions "behind my back". It does not mean not caring, but it means noticing that you care, and noticing how that feels, and noticing what the impulses tell you, and then making a decision based on that information"

What role does the fact that you care, feel, and have impulses play in your judgement about whether to perform a given action?

Those facts by themselves do not reveal the matter connected to the cases that you are judging.

That's why I'm trying to confirm your standard of judgement that you apply.

"But we (or I am at least) are happier when we actively make that choice."

What do you indicate by happiness?

Re: Vipassana Trip Report by Rap Genius Founder

#56
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In terms of benefits, consider meditation a tool to understand your mind and to be better able to understand your drives and motivations, and to learn how to focus your attention on various aspects of yourself. What "result" you get from that depends very much on you and your motivations and desires, but what I feel I get from it is a stronger appreciation of the world around me, better concentration, and better im…

Concentration is an ability to remain focused on something. It does not have "results" other than the ability to retain that focus for a longer period of time or with fewer distractions. In terms of understanding my mind, you seem to be very focused on absolute, objective outcomes. It is not that simple. What questions would you ask? And how would you measure the outcomes? A lot of questions you might ask can only be…

> In terms of understanding my mind, you seem to be very focused on absolute, objective outcomes. It is not that simple. What questions would you ask?

When you understand consciousness, you can see that it operates in a fixed principle. Everything that you've done and everything that happens to you all accumulates in you. Things that are latent within you produce the phenomenon of your mind when you meet a given thing.

In order to see your mind I just check what you can see by asking you about what you say you know.

If someone says they know something, they must also show people the evidence of what they know.

You talked a lot about the effect of meditation on your mind but you don't inform people what result it has in their life. Nor do you fully realize why you are experiencing peace through that process.

What use is concentration? All the facts and phenomena that appear in people are determined by what existed in them from the past. When people get distracted it's because of their karma inside. But concentration is not the way to suppress karma, and nirvana (peace) is only attainable by fully stopping karma. The fact of the matter is that only awakening to what exists can stop karma. You have to be aware of yourself and awake to what it is all the time in order to differentiate between right and wrong. Concentration doesn't affect your ability to distinguish good from bad.

It's a fact that meditation is not how Gautama Buddha obtained Enlightenment. His ascetic practice was different than everyone around him. And after he opened his eyes through his Enlightenment, he never taught people that they should practice concentration, nor not to think. He guided them in the opposite direction and advised that people should not accept something as fact without the process of thorough confirmation. It doesn't mean concentrating on the questions. It means that you check the answers in the living reality.

Re: Vipassana Trip Report by Rap Genius Founder

#57
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not saying it's easy. I'm saying nobody can really help you.

That belief that it is difficult or that you need help are themselves arising objects. It is helpful to get help -- someone holding space for you can be very helpful -- but ultimately , this is between you and you.

I wasn't saying it was hard either. I was saying it's idiotic to say "it's awfully noisy in my head when I try to meditate, can you quiet it down for me?" If you really think that, then I suggest you've wasted a lot of time pointing at things and calling them arising objects and wasted very little time meditating.

Re: Vipassana Trip Report by Rap Genius Founder

#58
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After reading about meditation recently, I felt inspired and have been trying to meditate for 10 minutes every night before bed. I started this around a week ago. In the last two days I have begun to wonder if I should find a good teacher. I find it _insanely_ hard to hold my focus for that ten minute period. However much I try, I often catch myself thinking about something else - without realising how I got onto tha…

Stick with it. A week is nothing. And try this series of audio recordings which include short guided meditation periods: http://www.audiodharma.org/series/1/talk/1762/ (Gil Fronsdal, Introduction to Meditation) They're a good secular introduction to mindfulness meditation. (Gil Fronsdal is a buddhist, but in this series he takes great care to avoid mixing the religious aspects with the meditation teaching, to the ext…

Thank you! I feel encouraged to persevere.
Post reply on HN