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The Fallacy of Money As A Means

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Re: The Fallacy of Money As A Means

#51

Post by lsc »

calinet6 wrote: post #4

This is a generally short-sighted article, that looks inward but not at the bigger picture. I want to make a lot of money because I want to start a family, and I want them to have the best life and the best opportunities available. Not to be spoiled, but simply to have a good life. And that's just the start. I want to make money so I can help people. To be able to invest in things which might cure diseases, solve hun…

>I want to start a family, and I want them to have the best life and the best opportunities available. Not to be spoiled, but simply to have a good life.

This... does not always work out how you think it will.

I'm the oldest of six. (Divorced/remarried parents, 3 kids each). I'm dramatically more successful than any of my siblings, adjusted for age. According to the tests, I'm not any smarter than them; according to in-school performance, well, I'm about the worst of the bunch, academically.

Now part of this was just plain luck; I graduated from highschool in like 97-98, and had a solid sysadmin/programming job within months. If I had gone to college? There's no way I would have been able to do as well looking for work in 2002.

But, I think a lot of it was that when I was growing up? money wasn't a given. I mean, my parents weren't dirt poor or anything; they owned a house, etc... But, I watched as they moved up from renting crappy places to buying their first house. Clothing often came from goodwill. They loaned me money to get a cheap car when I got out of high school, but I was expected to pay them back. If I worked hard and got good grades and scholarships, there'd probably have been some help for college, but it certainly wasn't a given.

By the time my siblings came of age? my parents were in much better shape.

Now, I mean, when I say I'm more successful, I mean financially, maybe they are happier, I don't know. It's quite possible; I certainly wouldn't call myself well-adjusted. And certainly, that can be more important than money; but I'm pretty much the only one here that wouldn't be in trouble if our parental safety net went away, and that's kindof a big thing, I think.

But, my point is? more money does not always mean more successful children. Children look at what you do, not what you say, so if you are optimizing for successful children, it's probably best to have them watch you /become/ successful, not watch how you act after you have become successful, and have time to enjoy the fruits of that effort.

Re: The Fallacy of Money As A Means

#52

Post by mikeocool »

> He tells people “he likes building things” because that seems to be a publicly acceptable rationale for building a tech company…but super secretly he just sees starting a tech company as a means to generating an inordinate amount of wealth quickly

I have a hard time believing that anyone who is only fueled by money and does not truly enjoy 'building things' would last all that long starting a company.

I know a great many writers. Not many people get rich writing (if $1 billion tech company exits are black swans, then JK Rowling is like a rainbow swan or something), and yet there are still people who choose to write. They truly enjoy writing, they make their lives work even though they no they're not very likely to end up with a million dollar book deal.

I get the feeling from most of the really great people I've met in the tech world that they would be 'building things' even if it there wasn't the seemingly realistic possibility of millions of dollars. They're not in it for the end game of travel or sex, they're in it because they're only happy 'building things.'

Re: The Fallacy of Money As A Means

#53

Post by joonix »

This article might be relevant if you're 20 years old. For the other parts of your life, when you want to have a family, and a spouse (whom you don't spend all your time arguing about money with), and also enjoy the nice parts of life like traveling, a comfortable home in a good area with good schools, the ability to change whatever you're doing if you're unhappy, to get great healthcare should you need it, etc etc... you need wealth. Period. Btw, a high income, high expense lifestyle is not "rich" because you are a slave to your job. Wealth is an entirely different world all together.

Re: The Fallacy of Money As A Means

#54

Post by niklaslogren »

This article really resonates with me.

I've come to roughly the same conclusion as the author; namely, that I should focus on figuring out my real motivations and work to fulfill them, rather than blindly follow the "more-money-more-happiness" default route provided for all of us.

I find it interesting that other commenters react so strongly to this article. I think the article is a sobering one, and that the author makes a good point. After thinking about it, if you come to the conclusion that more money _is_ what you need to fulfill your goals, then by all means go ahead. Introspection is never wrong.

Re: The Fallacy of Money As A Means

#55

Post by CurtMonash »

When I worked on Wall Street, it was common to have a "number" in mind -- a level of wealth one wanted to earn, after which one would retire.

By way of contrast, I got out after I'd only worked there about 5 years, with enough savings to support me for only a few more.

Frankly, I wish I'd stuck with it and solved the "earning money" problem for life for once and for all.

I.e., while I'm generally in agreement with this line of discussion, there are also plenty of cases to just work at something not too unpleasant in return for the money it provides one.

Re: The Fallacy of Money As A Means

#56

Post by thedufer »

lsc wrote: post #51
calinet6 wrote: post #4

This is a generally short-sighted article, that looks inward but not at the bigger picture. I want to make a lot of money because I want to start a family, and I want them to have the best life and the best opportunities available. Not to be spoiled, but simply to have a good life. And that's just the start. I want to make money so I can help people. To be able to invest in things which might cure diseases, solve hun…

>I want to start a family, and I want them to have the best life and the best opportunities available. Not to be spoiled, but simply to have a good life. This... does not always work out how you think it will. I'm the oldest of six. (Divorced/remarried parents, 3 kids each). I'm dramatically more successful than any of my siblings, adjusted for age. According to the tests, I'm not any smarter than them; according to…

Anecdotes are fun, but the data suggests over and over again that financially successful parents have more financially successful children.

Re: The Fallacy of Money As A Means

#57

Post by michaelochurch »

calinet6 wrote: post #4

This is a generally short-sighted article, that looks inward but not at the bigger picture. I want to make a lot of money because I want to start a family, and I want them to have the best life and the best opportunities available. Not to be spoiled, but simply to have a good life. And that's just the start. I want to make money so I can help people. To be able to invest in things which might cure diseases, solve hun…

Spot on. Money is a conflation of two social processes or decisions:

    a. Who gets to have private jets and get into hot nightclubs.
    b. Who gets to build things of importance to the world.
Most of us are smart enough to have limited interest in (a)-- if that's what you're into, you'll never have enough-- but have an obsessive, sometimes anger-inducing and debilitating, focus on (b).

Re: The Fallacy of Money As A Means

#58

Post by calinet6 »

lsc wrote: post #51
calinet6 wrote: post #4

This is a generally short-sighted article, that looks inward but not at the bigger picture. I want to make a lot of money because I want to start a family, and I want them to have the best life and the best opportunities available. Not to be spoiled, but simply to have a good life. And that's just the start. I want to make money so I can help people. To be able to invest in things which might cure diseases, solve hun…

>I want to start a family, and I want them to have the best life and the best opportunities available. Not to be spoiled, but simply to have a good life. This... does not always work out how you think it will. I'm the oldest of six. (Divorced/remarried parents, 3 kids each). I'm dramatically more successful than any of my siblings, adjusted for age. According to the tests, I'm not any smarter than them; according to…

Totally agree, lots of great points there. I had much the same experience (except for the college experience) and hope to take it into account. I love the last bit about how children watch what you do, not what you say. Completely agree.

Re: The Fallacy of Money As A Means

#59

Post by smartician »

thedufer wrote: post #56
lsc wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I want to start a family, and I want them to have the best life and the best opportunities available. Not to be spoiled, but simply to have a good life. This... does not always work out how you think it will. I'm the oldest of six. (Divorced/remarried parents, 3 kids each). I'm dramatically more successful than any of my siblings, adjusted for age. According to the tests, I'm not any smarter than them; according to…

Anecdotes are fun, but the data suggests over and over again that financially successful parents have more financially successful children.

* citation needed

I can see how this is true when you compare poor vs. non-poor families. But the article is about staying middle class vs. pursuing riches by founding a successful company. It's probably true that the children of millionaires will be financially better off than children of middle class families, but that leads back to the point of the article: Will that affluence make them happy and more fulfilled?

Re: The Fallacy of Money As A Means

#60

Post by calinet6 »

hosh wrote: post #47
calinet6 wrote: post #4

This is a generally short-sighted article, that looks inward but not at the bigger picture. I want to make a lot of money because I want to start a family, and I want them to have the best life and the best opportunities available. Not to be spoiled, but simply to have a good life. And that's just the start. I want to make money so I can help people. To be able to invest in things which might cure diseases, solve hun…

This is a great article. Looking inward is the bigger picture. When you are not impeccable about your intent, then much of your subconscious awareness is being diverted towards those hidden agendas rather than the outward goal. You come off as inauthentic, your ability to draw like-minded people to your goals are splintered. You can get those hidden agendas directly. Why make a lot of money to change the world? Chang…

Very insightful reply, I do need to think a bit harder next time, I believe I left my zen out.
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