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Boston College Campus Police: "Using Prompt Commands" May Be a Sign of Criminal Activity

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Re: Boston College Campus Police: "Using Prompt Commands" May Be a Sign of Criminal Activity

#51

Post by jhancock »

tokenadult wrote: post #39
jhancock wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

10% may not be the "correct" standard, but I have seen police arrest and search people with zero evidence.

How often have you seen police arrest and search people? I'm always amazed at how rarely I've seen that, even when living in the heart of big cities.

This is a dead topic I think, so not sure this will post, but I'll try to answer.

About 20 years ago, I was driving home from work (Atlanta). I was still in college and was a co-op student at "big blue". Great job, I worked 7 days a week and actually slept under my desk at times. This one night I was driving home around 2am. I think it was a Thursday, could have been Friday. A cop in Decatur (That's home to Emory) pulls me over in front of the courthouse for a having a broken headlight. Fair enough, I was a poor college student, but I'll take the ticket. Not good enough for him, he was trolling for drunk drivers. He spent a lot of time asking me questions and after shining a flashlight throughout my car asked me if he could search my trunk. I told him "no sir, I don't think that has anything to do with a broken headlight". The next words from him were "get out of the car, boy". It went downhill from there. It was a very abusive next 30 minutes...he was careful to tell me it was only him and me out there, no witnesses, until he finally searched my trunk anyway (which he could do now that I was arrested)...in the end, the judge sent me home knowing full well what happened and didn't so much as admonish the police.

Since this happened to me, I've been careful to notice the stories of others. There are some great police officers throughout America; they deserve our respect. Unfortunately, the "brotherhood" protects the bad ones as well.

Re: Boston College Campus Police: "Using Prompt Commands" May Be a Sign of Criminal Activity

#52

Post by CaptainMorgan »

Confusion wrote: post #47
spoondan wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is sending a forged e-mail accusing your roommate of being gay illegal? It sounds juvenile and malicious. But I don't see how it's a crime. Anyway, you've misread the warrant application. The forged e-mails were tracked to a dynamic IP address. They searched for anyone else using the same computer name ("bootleg-laptop"), and found that the accused had used the same computer name but NOT the same MAC address six mont…

It seems everyone overlooks the fact that the warrant was also after an undefined number of pirated movies. If found, that alone can cause the suspect serious grief. I wonder if the roommate will regret his testimony later on...

I think you overlooked several discussions before you. I talked specifically about this.

Re: Boston College Campus Police: "Using Prompt Commands" May Be a Sign of Criminal Activity

#53

Post by [deleted] »

CaptainMorgan wrote: post #50
ecuzzillo wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What happens if the court subpoenas the contents of the filesystem? If you don't supply the key, don't you go to jail?

There are some filesystem/full-disk encryption programs that claim they can get around this. Apparently (I've never used it), if one is required to provide the adversary or authorities with the passphrase, they only get so far - into the virtual disk, which then presents the illusion that there is nothing else on the disk, further claiming their product makes it literally impossible for them to detect the real conten…

[deleted]

Re: Boston College Campus Police: "Using Prompt Commands" May Be a Sign of Criminal Activity

#54

Post by kragen »

billswift wrote: post #31
kragen wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is sending a forged e-mail accusing your roommate of being gay illegal? It sounds juvenile and malicious. But I don't see how it's a crime. Yes, given that we live in a society where many people think homosexual behavior is grossly immoral, that's prima facie defamation.

No it is not illegal. Defamation, even if it exists, which in this case looks pretty doubtful, is a civil tort.

You're right that defamation is generally a civil tort and not a crime (generally, that is, in the US; I don't know about the jurisdiction in question), and so the police should not have been involved. Thanks!

Re: Boston College Campus Police: "Using Prompt Commands" May Be a Sign of Criminal Activity

#55

Post by kragen »

javanix wrote: post #27
kragen wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The free-speech argument kind of loses its luster when you send something without your name attached. Maybe you're not from the US, but the US has a legal tradition of strong protections for anonymous and pseudonymous speech. The Federalist Papers, which were a key part of the political discourse leading to the existence of the US, were published anonymously. So maybe what you say is true in Ukraine or China or Myanm…

I am from the United States - anonymous and pseudonymous protections wouldn't apply to this case of slander/libel and/or criminal harassment. Anonymously outing someone against their will does not fall under the same protections that critiquing an unfair government does. I didn't mean to imply that all anonymous talk is without protection, just that in this specific case, the defendant in question would probably have…

Usually, freedom of speech is not a defense against accusations of defamation; the anonymity angle is a red herring.

Re: Boston College Campus Police: "Using Prompt Commands" May Be a Sign of Criminal Activity

#56

Post by eru »

CaptainMorgan wrote: post #50
ecuzzillo wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What happens if the court subpoenas the contents of the filesystem? If you don't supply the key, don't you go to jail?

There are some filesystem/full-disk encryption programs that claim they can get around this. Apparently (I've never used it), if one is required to provide the adversary or authorities with the passphrase, they only get so far - into the virtual disk, which then presents the illusion that there is nothing else on the disk, further claiming their product makes it literally impossible for them to detect the real conten…

Yes, plausible deniability is possible. Look at Off-the-record messaging (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Off-the-Record_Messaging) for an example. Cipher texts is these system can be decrypted to anything you like --- not only the real plain text.

Re: Boston College Campus Police: "Using Prompt Commands" May Be a Sign of Criminal Activity

#57

Post by greendestiny »

CaptainMorgan wrote: post #48
greendestiny wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the popularity of this article has more in common with the popularity of the "how to care for your introvert" article. Basically the group is trying to define itself, and persecution is one of those very common rallying points. People with beautiful and misunderstood introverted abilities are being singled out by the man. If you enjoy this kind of thing there are sites like reddit which are perfect for expres…

It may be true that they're trying to define themselves, but if so I'd say it's because they're exploiting an opportunity they've found with regard to so many holes in the investigation. But more importantly, I disagree that this is more suited for Reddit discussion (if that was your point). Here at HN as I'm sure you're aware, we have a record of intelligent, coherent and stimulating debate about a wide range of imp…

Its not that I think it doesn't belong here, the reception the article has gotten worries me a little. These rallying articles that provoke this strong sense of identity in a community can actually swamp the real character of the site. The mutual outrage and sense of purpose is compelling but its superficial. Legal action, especially at the initial stages when police are involved, is particularly inflammatory because everyone jumps to conclusions. The justice system takes time to process, but this sense of mutual outrage has no patience.

Re: Boston College Campus Police: "Using Prompt Commands" May Be a Sign of Criminal Activity

#59

Post by cnlwsu »

chaosmachine wrote: post #4

I learned the hard way back in high school: Don't let anyone see you using a command prompt because the next time something gets hacked, you will be suspect number one. It's sad to see nothing has changed since the 90s.

I wouldn't agree with this completely. In the university I attended, I told the IT staff about security issues with their wifi network. I even gave demonstrations to the other computer science students (via the cs club) on breaking into/decrypting said type of wireless networks. The IT staff was friendly and helpful and updated their security mechanisms. The problems happen at times like this when people with no clue and don't know what is being said get involved. After all, big words I don't understand are scary to me when lawyers talk too.

Re: Boston College Campus Police: "Using Prompt Commands" May Be a Sign of Criminal Activity

#60

Post by dagobart »

dagobart wrote: post #10

We should have an incompetency-of-the-day world map. Just to point out the more numb places. Or where not to go to.

Later on I actually did what I should have done in the first place -- actually read the thingy the police filed to get approved to search the guy's place. As others have pointed out before me, the police indeed _has_ a point here. The guy fiddled with the students' marks system of the school, and that imho really is something the police should deal with.

On the other hand, the quuotes on the eff.org page didn't state that issue at all and instead preferred to point out some exaggerately abstruse line of argue, like: the guy was using a shell and therefore he got searched.

I think, the intend of that indeed was to manipulate the readers of that "report", and to get that "report" re-told.

So, for me the lesson learned from this incident are actually two: 1) If there's a report of an obviously abstruse reasoning, have a second look and dig into it yourself (unless you're really not interested in it). 2) Never trust a press release, not even if it gets released by some of the good guys, i.e. not even the eff.

I think, by accidents like this one, even "the good ones" of organizations loose credibility.

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