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Apple's Data Centers Now Running on 100% Renewable Energy

macrumors.com

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Re: Apple's Data Centers Now Running on 100% Renewable Energy

#51

Post by smackfu »

Xuzz wrote: post #49
adventured wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their North Carolina datacenter isn't getting even a tiny fraction of its power from solar. So I'm not sure what they're calling renewable energy. It's basically a flat out lie.

How do you know that more about this than Apple does? I don't see any reason to believe they're lying, from what you said?

Actually, after rereading, Apple just says they generate X amount of solar, and that the datacenter is 100% renewable, leading dumb people like me to assume that the datacenter is 100% solar. But since they never say how much energy the datacenter needs, that's not supported by the facts... I assume they are actually supplementing the solar with purchased renewable energy.

Re: Apple's Data Centers Now Running on 100% Renewable Energy

#52

Post by [deleted] »

adventured wrote: post #47
smackfu wrote: post #5

More info: http://www.apple.com/environment/renewable-energy/ It seems like the North Carolina one is home-grown solar, the Oregon one is hydroelectric (as are most datacenters in Oregon), and the California one is (purchased) wind power.

Their North Carolina datacenter isn't getting even a tiny fraction of its power from solar. So I'm not sure what they're calling renewable energy. It's basically a flat out lie.

[deleted]

Re: Apple's Data Centers Now Running on 100% Renewable Energy

#53

Post by smackfu »

barney54 wrote: post #9

This is some pretty deceptive marketing. Apple's data centers still run on coal in places like North Carolina because that's is what is producing the electricity on the grid. Their renewable projects produce a decent amount of electricity, but one of the most critical issues of the electrical grid is stability and solar, even with the fuel cells does not provide enough electricity on cloudy days or over night. Solar,…

Yes, the only way that intentionally purchasing renewable energy matters is once it goes over the amount that would be renewable anyways.

Like if NC is already 10% renewable and 90% coal, the energy company can sell 10% of it as renewable-only without changing a single thing. It just means the average consumer goes from 10% renewable to 0% renewable.

Re: Apple's Data Centers Now Running on 100% Renewable Energy

#54

Post by rfurlong »

yalogin wrote: post #48
rfurlong wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the linked article Apple also states that the entire company runs on 75% renewable energy. This is the figure I am criticizing.

Even there they only say corporate facilities and nothing about manufacturing (which is done by outside companies). Do you think they are lying about their corporate facilities using 75% renewable energy? If so can you please point me to any article contradicting that?

Never said they were lying. I am saying its a purely PR number that doesn't accurately depict the amount of energy that is used for them thrive as much as they have.

Re: Apple's Data Centers Now Running on 100% Renewable Energy

#55

Post by ChuckMcM »

barney54 wrote: post #50
ChuckMcM wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Simultaneously correct and incorrect :-) A number of great studies have shown the futility of depending on transient energy renewables (solar, wind, tides) for all generation, and yet the ability to cover peak loads does directly reduce the required amount of non-renewable fuel. If you're renewables generate the same amount of energy during their 'active' hours, that you consume in total, you have effectively arbitra…

Solar and wind do not necessary help cover peak loads--because they are not reliable. Instead, much of the peak load will be covered by peaking plants (which are generally natural gas). For example, here's the current load data for the California grid operator: http://www.caiso.com/Pages/TodaysOutlook.aspx#Renewables Note that today's peak electricity production will come at 9pm--far after solar is helpful. Solar and…

Ok, perhaps this works better:

100% of what Apple said is true, on a monthly basis the amount of energy they consume in their data centers is exactly equivalent to the amount of energy, generated by renewable sources, that they create or buy.

Re: Apple's Data Centers Now Running on 100% Renewable Energy

#56

Post by paul_f »

smackfu wrote: post #53
barney54 wrote: post #9

This is some pretty deceptive marketing. Apple's data centers still run on coal in places like North Carolina because that's is what is producing the electricity on the grid. Their renewable projects produce a decent amount of electricity, but one of the most critical issues of the electrical grid is stability and solar, even with the fuel cells does not provide enough electricity on cloudy days or over night. Solar,…

Yes, the only way that intentionally purchasing renewable energy matters is once it goes over the amount that would be renewable anyways. Like if NC is already 10% renewable and 90% coal, the energy company can sell 10% of it as renewable-only without changing a single thing. It just means the average consumer goes from 10% renewable to 0% renewable.

Electricity is fungible. The power company cannot possibly serve a customer renewable electrons from the grid. This whole thing is absurd and Apple should be ashamed for making the claim.

Re: Apple's Data Centers Now Running on 100% Renewable Energy

#57

Post by prodigal_erik »

niggler wrote: post #30
octix wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's Apple's style...

To be fair, their products are really improving in the area of energy efficiency EDIT: If you are going to downvote, at least point to proof that it isn't happening

They've all but abandoned making upgradable tools in favor of disposable appliances, which severely dilutes the energy savings from running them.

Re: Apple's Data Centers Now Running on 100% Renewable Energy

#58

Post by j00lz »

Xuzz wrote: post #49
adventured wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their North Carolina datacenter isn't getting even a tiny fraction of its power from solar. So I'm not sure what they're calling renewable energy. It's basically a flat out lie.

How do you know that more about this than Apple does? I don't see any reason to believe they're lying, from what you said?

Amazon's James Hamilton estimates the north Carolina 171 acre solar array only generates %4 of the energy required for the datacenter

http://perspectives.mvdirona.com/2012/03/17/ILoveSolarPowerB...

Re: Apple's Data Centers Now Running on 100% Renewable Energy

#59

Post by salem »

rfurlong wrote: post #54
yalogin wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even there they only say corporate facilities and nothing about manufacturing (which is done by outside companies). Do you think they are lying about their corporate facilities using 75% renewable energy? If so can you please point me to any article contradicting that?

Never said they were lying. I am saying its a purely PR number that doesn't accurately depict the amount of energy that is used for them thrive as much as they have.

Basically, they are talking about their corporate operations and ignoring the actual resources consumed during their products' lifecycle from manufacture->distribution->sale->use->recycling/disposal. Hence my comment that they are green-washing.

Re: Apple's Data Centers Now Running on 100% Renewable Energy

#60

Post by sjwright »

prodigal_erik wrote: post #57
niggler wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, their products are really improving in the area of energy efficiency EDIT: If you are going to downvote, at least point to proof that it isn't happening

They've all but abandoned making upgradable tools in favor of disposable appliances, which severely dilutes the energy savings from running them.

Nice in theory, but those upgradable tools still got treated like disposable appliances by well over 95% of the market.
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