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If Apple makes an iPad Neo, it's all over

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Re: If Apple makes an iPad Neo, it's all over

#51

Post by static_motion »

hadlock wrote: post #6

I think the industry has already agreed to give this product category to Apple. Everyone needs a phone, but only specific types of users need a tablet. Apple's tablet is Good Enough for everyone, and they last forever. The o.g. iPad Air we bought in Nov 2020 is still chugging along and we use it... basically only to watch movies on airplane rides etc. And I am primarily a linux/android user, but this is the one Apple…

I don't know whether to consider the fact that you find a device lasting 6 years an impressive feat as testament to how crappy devices, especially mobile ones, have been for the past decade, or how used everyone is to abandon perfectly good devices just because "it's X years old".

Re: If Apple makes an iPad Neo, it's all over

#52

Post by kaliszad »

ompogUe wrote: post #49
hadlock wrote: post #6

I think the industry has already agreed to give this product category to Apple. Everyone needs a phone, but only specific types of users need a tablet. Apple's tablet is Good Enough for everyone, and they last forever. The o.g. iPad Air we bought in Nov 2020 is still chugging along and we use it... basically only to watch movies on airplane rides etc. And I am primarily a linux/android user, but this is the one Apple…

The only Apple product I still have is a 2010 ipad 1. Only use it as a clock, violin tuner, and workout timer, but am amazed it's still going like an old volkswagen.

Perhaps you can use it as a Schneidebrett: https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x3zm0q1

Re: If Apple makes an iPad Neo, it's all over

#53

Post by Marsymars »

hocuspocus wrote: post #50
Marsymars wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Can you imagine Apple giving you AirPods Pro or a Watch if you buy the next iPhone 18 on day 1? Apple does exactly this, they just launder it out to their carrier partners. My wife's carrier was recently offering a free Apple Watch if you pre-ordered a new iPhone before launch. Similarly, Apple was already selling a laptop (the M1 MacBook Air) at MacBook Neo prices, but only via Walmart (and they were continuing pr…

Carrier deals aren't comparable as they're subsidized by inflated phone plans. If you buy an iPhone on day 1 from the Apple store you're certainly not getting any gift or discount. With Google you can pre-order and get a $200-300 gift, wait for deals (Black Friday, Christmas, ...) or if you aren't in a rush, wait six months for resellers and carriers to invariably start dumping their stock at half the MSRP. Meanwhile…

> Carrier deals aren't comparable as they're subsidized by inflated phone plans.

I don't have any insight into what deals the carriers have on the backend, but in my region, the price delta between like-for-like BYOD plans and plans with subsidized iPhones are effectively nil.

Either the carriers are getting discounts from Apple, or everyone with BYOD plans are subsidizing phones for people who get them through carriers.

e.g. I'm currently seeing a carrier plan where the total plan + device cost over 24 months is ~$1,600 and you come out of it free and clear with a 512gb iPhone Air that's $1,749 retail. I don't see how that's possible for the carrier to offer if they're not getting discounts from Apple.

My point is that Apple doesn't want to look like they're giving discounts on their store, so they engineer any discounts to go through third parties.

Re: If Apple makes an iPad Neo, it's all over

#54

Post by hocuspocus »

Marsymars wrote: post #53
hocuspocus wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Carrier deals aren't comparable as they're subsidized by inflated phone plans. If you buy an iPhone on day 1 from the Apple store you're certainly not getting any gift or discount. With Google you can pre-order and get a $200-300 gift, wait for deals (Black Friday, Christmas, ...) or if you aren't in a rush, wait six months for resellers and carriers to invariably start dumping their stock at half the MSRP. Meanwhile…

> Carrier deals aren't comparable as they're subsidized by inflated phone plans. I don't have any insight into what deals the carriers have on the backend, but in my region, the price delta between like-for-like BYOD plans and plans with subsidized iPhones are effectively nil. Either the carriers are getting discounts from Apple, or everyone with BYOD plans are subsidizing phones for people who get them through carri…

I work at a carrier in Switzerland, if I take the phone we push at the top of our inventory, the iPhone 17 Pro 256 GB:

Phone: 1099 (Apple's MSRP). 24-month phone plan, 50/month the first year, then 81/month: 1572. Discount: -300

Now BYOD:

Phone: 1067 at the biggest and most reputable online retailer. Near identical phone plan sold through our discount/virtual brand: 30/month i.e. 720 over 24 months (but you can leave anytime).

So even assuming you buy it on day 1 with zero discount from Apple's MSRP, that 300 gift costs you 852 CHF really.

Now if I look at our most agressive competitor, you get the phone for free if you spend at least 1752 on a 24-month phone plan.

They have a better phone plan at 15/month i.e. 360 over 2 years. BYOD is still way cheaper.

Re: If Apple makes an iPad Neo, it's all over

#55

Post by rchaud »

I think the the author is greatly overstating how big the tablet market is for the product strategy he's hoping for. "Tablet-optimized apps" are a historical artifact of the 2010-2015 period when tablets were a new and exciting category of internet-connected gadget with a plethora of use cases in entertainment and productivity, held back only by 'blown up' versions of mobile apps. Within a few years however, most apps people use (Netflix, Office, Google Docs) were redesigned to scale to the size of the screen, in the same way websites do.

A decade on, the market has spoken. Tablets are overwhelmingly used for Netflix, YouTube and casual mobile games, use cases where specs don't matter and every tablet is more or less "good enough". Maybe a million or so users have an iPad for digital art or as a laptop replacement. Even the cheapest model iPad has pen, mouse and keyboard support. So what would an iPad Neo add?

Re: If Apple makes an iPad Neo, it's all over

#56

Post by weikju »

sroussey wrote: post #14
williadc wrote: post #3

Apple does make the product described in this article, aside from the fantasy price. It's called the iPad.

They should rename it the iPad Neo so we don't refer to as "the just iPad" or plain ipad.

And maybe the second generation could be the New iPad Neo ...

thankfully they quickly gave up on "new" after the 2nd iPad....

Re: If Apple makes an iPad Neo, it's all over

#57

Post by surgical_fire »

tracerbulletx wrote: post #42
surgical_fire wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had an iPad that Appled forced into obsolecence. I had to throw a perfectly ok piece of hardware on the trash because it was madr unusable by the manufacturer. It's the main reason I despise Apple, including its hardware. I replaced it with a Samsung A7. It's even better than the iPad as I could sideload a manga reader that syncs with Komga, amazing stuff to read manga. And I can install LineageOS if need be. Objec…

wtf are you talking about apple supports their devices significantly longer than android..

This is meaningless when LineageOS exists.

My Samsung tablet will have a much longer lifespan thanks to that.

Re: If Apple makes an iPad Neo, it's all over

#58

Post by naet »

What do you really want to use a tablet for?

The main use I see from people is watching netflix or youtube. There are lots of ipads that are basically just expensive youtube machines. So in that sense a cheap ipad might be seen by some as an upgraded larger screen vs watching TV on their phone screen... but there are already a lot of existing cheap tablets that can do that. Someone gifted my son an Amazon one that I think was around $50 and works fine for that purpose.

You can read ebooks, but e-ink is a lot more pleasant to read I think.

You could get a stylus and draw... but I think that's a more niche use that not as many people are into, and I think professional artists are more likely to buy an art focused product over the generalized tablet / ipad.

For serious work, you're probably better off with a small laptop and keyboard. I know you can get a keyboard for a tablet, but at that point why not just have a laptop?

I'm not sure I see the vision.

Re: If Apple makes an iPad Neo, it's all over

#59

Post by Marsymars »

hocuspocus wrote: post #54
Marsymars wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Carrier deals aren't comparable as they're subsidized by inflated phone plans. I don't have any insight into what deals the carriers have on the backend, but in my region, the price delta between like-for-like BYOD plans and plans with subsidized iPhones are effectively nil. Either the carriers are getting discounts from Apple, or everyone with BYOD plans are subsidizing phones for people who get them through carri…

I work at a carrier in Switzerland, if I take the phone we push at the top of our inventory, the iPhone 17 Pro 256 GB: Phone: 1099 (Apple's MSRP). 24-month phone plan, 50/month the first year, then 81/month: 1572. Discount: -300 Now BYOD: Phone: 1067 at the biggest and most reputable online retailer. Near identical phone plan sold through our discount/virtual brand: 30/month i.e. 720 over 24 months (but you can leave…

Okay, so maybe your carriers aren't getting good discounts. The existence of plans without good discounts doesn't really show anything. Of course some carriers will have some plans without good discounts.

Like I said, for one of my local carriers, I'm seeing a plan that costs $1,600 that includes both two years of service and a $1,749 MSRP phone.

There's no possible way for a BYOD plan to be cheaper after accounting for the phone MSRP, they'd have to pay you $150 for the SIM card and two years of service.

Re: If Apple makes an iPad Neo, it's all over

#60

Post by selivanovp »

hadlock wrote: post #6

I think the industry has already agreed to give this product category to Apple. Everyone needs a phone, but only specific types of users need a tablet. Apple's tablet is Good Enough for everyone, and they last forever. The o.g. iPad Air we bought in Nov 2020 is still chugging along and we use it... basically only to watch movies on airplane rides etc. And I am primarily a linux/android user, but this is the one Apple…

I still use my iPad mini 2 I bought in 2014 to read books. The only problem with it is that reading books is one of the very few things I can do with it these days as Safari is no longer capable of rendering most websites, most apps are not supported, and generally iOS 12 ate most of the memory device has. So yeah, it's my bookreader still, but nothing more.
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