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Japan implements language proficiency requirements for certain visa applicants

japantimes.co.jp

51–60 of 157 posts

Re: Japan implements language proficiency requirements for certain visa applicants

#51
post #38
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except the Swiss are total arseholes about it, they won't even grant citizenship to people born there or who've lived there for twenty years and speak the language. Many want to cap total population at 10 million, we'll see what happens in June. And twelve years ago, the Swiss voted to restrict EU FoM for itself and the backlash was instant. Can't blame the government, this is the Swiss voting public doing their best…

It looks like they are proud of their country and want to keep it as is. They’ve seen what limitless immigration did to other countries and want none of it. Respect to them.

Switzerland has a fertility rate of about 1.4 and decreasing, unless they do something, there won't be much of a country left in a few generations. Solutions can involve immigration or natalism, but something has to change.

Japan is worse.

Re: Japan implements language proficiency requirements for certain visa applicants

#52

As someone who has been living in Japan for years now, and still has a long way to go learning the language, I generally support language proficiency requirements. First, it should be noted that these are fairly common sense requirements designed to reduce fraud - requiring people applying for work visas that require Japanese proficiency to actually be able to speak Japanese. I suspect there will be more requirements…

I did two years in Lausanne without speaking French and 9 years in Beijing with…maybe 2nd year proficiency in Chinese (better than most foreigners, but hardly fluent!). You can totally live in society without fluency, Switzerland being harder only because I never studied French before.

If you are doing work with a world market, you are kind of expected to speak the language of that work and not necessarily the country you are in.

Re: Japan implements language proficiency requirements for certain visa applicants

#53
post #6

I mean, seems fair. If I'm applying for a work visa where the work I'm doing would require me to know Japanese, I should know Japanese.

The key thing is that the ESI category includes a lot of work which you don't need to know Japanese. For example, software engineering jobs in Japan are often at either larger multinational companies or companies with enough presence outside of Japan that they have teams which are in English. Japan has been on a recent anti-immigration kick via making visas harder and more expensive to get while also blaming them for…

> software engineering jobs in Japan are often at either larger multinational companies or companies with enough presence outside of Japan that they have teams which are in English.

Just because you work in a multinational company where they have English speaking teams does not mean that you should not know the language. It is weird to assume that just because your first job is with an English speaking team you will always work with those teams or in that company at all.

What about daily life? Communication is a fundamental part of your activity as a civilian imo. Not understanding what is going on in a country without using some device to translate for you is not acceptable. Whether in a train or during an earthquake you must always be able to communicate.

Re: Japan implements language proficiency requirements for certain visa applicants

#54
post #23
post #5

Key detail: > Immigration authorities say the move is aimed at preventing cases in which foreign workers obtain visas under one category, but then engage in unrelated or lower-skilled work. The claim appears to be that people were using up visa slots for things like interpreters or other jobs where clearly you'd need good language skills to actually do the job, including in Japanese, with the intent all along of doin…

Its not shocking, I see it implemented ie in Switzerland, where half of the world tries to get in. Since each part has their own language and none of that is english, its pretty important to exist in society for anything but brief visitors. Its not restrictive as this (B2 is pretty high level in any language, here its weak B1) and resefved for 'higher' permits like C, for which you anyway need 10 years of residency i…

Not exactly. I got (and renewed) the Swiss permit with zero knowledge of any official language. However, my wife had to present the basic certificate or my promise that she would learn the language.

Re: Japan implements language proficiency requirements for certain visa applicants

#55
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except the Swiss are total arseholes about it, they won't even grant citizenship to people born there or who've lived there for twenty years and speak the language. Many want to cap total population at 10 million, we'll see what happens in June. And twelve years ago, the Swiss voted to restrict EU FoM for itself and the backlash was instant. Can't blame the government, this is the Swiss voting public doing their best…

Such dickheads the Swiss voting public, how dare they exercise a direct democracy?! So inconveniencing!

Yeah, do they think they have a country or something? Don’t they know they’re just an economic zone between France, Italy, and Germany.

Re: Japan implements language proficiency requirements for certain visa applicants

#56
post #51
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It looks like they are proud of their country and want to keep it as is. They’ve seen what limitless immigration did to other countries and want none of it. Respect to them.

Switzerland has a fertility rate of about 1.4 and decreasing, unless they do something, there won't be much of a country left in a few generations. Solutions can involve immigration or natalism, but something has to change. Japan is worse.

I don’t know anything about Switzerland, but immigration isn’t a solution to the prospect of Japan “not having a country left in a few generations.” There might be more or fewer people living on the islands, but “Japan” will be gone either way.

Re: Japan implements language proficiency requirements for certain visa applicants

#57
post #14
post #6

I mean, seems fair. If I'm applying for a work visa where the work I'm doing would require me to know Japanese, I should know Japanese.

Why do you need that requirement be validated by people and at a level not connection to the place of work?

To prevent fraud. It's the same reason governments have driving tests and tax or grant audits. If the government deferred to applicants for everything, there'd be no point in the application process.

Sure, there's a libertarian argument against limiting visas, imposing taxes, and issuing grants, but if you are going to, it requires some amount of enforcement to prevent rampant fraud.

Re: Japan implements language proficiency requirements for certain visa applicants

#58
post #51
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It looks like they are proud of their country and want to keep it as is. They’ve seen what limitless immigration did to other countries and want none of it. Respect to them.

Switzerland has a fertility rate of about 1.4 and decreasing, unless they do something, there won't be much of a country left in a few generations. Solutions can involve immigration or natalism, but something has to change. Japan is worse.

Africa has fertility rate 4.02 in 2025. Do you want Switzerland look like Africa?

Re: Japan implements language proficiency requirements for certain visa applicants

#59
So, on one hand, this is an excusable policy (as in, there are already immigration law apologists in here making excuses for it).

On the other hand, I don't like immigration control as a concept - countries should not operate like hereditary country clubs, and people should not have less freedom of movement than bags of money. More self-interestedly, I'm an American, and I know my country's infrastructure - both political and otherwise - is failing horribly. I don't want out yet, but I know I'm going to need out at some point in my lifetime. So every time I see a favorable country locking their doors, I shudder.

There's probably going to be at least one reply from a European saying this is a good thing - that American citizens (or, if things get really bad, American refugees) should be denied entry, under the theory that immigration is a welfare / free money for thieves program and that letting people leave destroyed countries just rewards people for destroying them.

This is, of course, bullshit, both because it's victim blame-y, AND because it covers up a shortcoming of the country making the excuse. The real reason countries try to avoid taking in refugees is that most countries are built like hereditary country clubs. They don't take in immigrants, so they don't know how to integrate immigrants. Japan in particular has a community of poorly-integrated American emigrants that largely just stick to themselves.

America, ironically enough, is one of the few countries that actually cracked the code on immigration. We used to have really generous family reunion visa programs, we have basically every immigrant population you can think of in every major city, and immigrants that come here integrate way better than ones that go to Europe. So it's not like countries have to be restrictive on immigration.

Instead, what I'm seeing is that immigration is being used by politicians to distract from their own countries' failings. It's the same story as what happened in America[1]: when shit breaks, people get rich off selling the fix, and so they pay[0] politicians to keep the system broken enough that they can continue profiting off of it. But this only works if you give the people some kind of excuse. The politics of scarcity are brutal, but scarcity becomes a far easier sell if you have a scapegoat. Some magical source of systemic burden you can shed without backlash. "The state-run insurance system isn't broken because we don't pay our doctors, it's broken because we have too many poor patients from other countries!"

[0] Not necessarily in the "bribery is free speech" way America does it, of course.

[1] Which would indicate to me that perhaps leaving the country is a fool's errand, if every other country is on the same curve.

Re: Japan implements language proficiency requirements for certain visa applicants

#60
post #54
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its not shocking, I see it implemented ie in Switzerland, where half of the world tries to get in. Since each part has their own language and none of that is english, its pretty important to exist in society for anything but brief visitors. Its not restrictive as this (B2 is pretty high level in any language, here its weak B1) and resefved for 'higher' permits like C, for which you anyway need 10 years of residency i…

Not exactly. I got (and renewed) the Swiss permit with zero knowledge of any official language. However, my wife had to present the basic certificate or my promise that she would learn the language.

Japan, ~like the US~, has no official language.

(edit: ~strike~)

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