Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Further human + AI + proof assistant work on Knuth's "Claude Cycles" problem

twitter.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

51–60 of 208 posts

Re: Further human + AI + proof assistant work on Knuth's "Claude Cycles" problem

#51

Post by slopinthebag »

pixl97 wrote: post #23
marsten wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the grand scheme it's good to invent things that replace human labor. It frees up people to do more interesting things. The goal should be to put everyone out of a job.

>It frees up people to do more interesting things Like beg on the corners and starve in the street? Trying to figure out how the basics of capitalism where labor is exchanged for money is not going to work well when the only jobs left are side gigs. Something will have to change and a lot of People will fight said change.

We will come up with new jobs, like we have for all of human history. I think even in an abundance utopia people will still work - we need purpose to sustain our existence.

The work will become even more fulfilling however.

Re: Further human + AI + proof assistant work on Knuth's "Claude Cycles" problem

#52

Post by siva7 »

piloto_ciego wrote: post #24
NitpickLawyer wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know your reply was half joking, so please take this the same way, but ... are you sure about that? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1ip68Vv7NE

This is truly amazing. Do people not really realize how amazing stuff like this is? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills here, but man, it certainly feels like we're on the edge of something quite amazing...

Autonomous robots murdering humans in warfare? That's at least the sense i got from reading this news site the past few days

Re: Further human + AI + proof assistant work on Knuth's "Claude Cycles" problem

#53

Post by vatsachak »

slopinthebag wrote: post #46
vatsachak wrote: post #36

I've always said this but AI will win a fields medal before being able to manage a McDonald's. Math seems difficult to us because it's like using a hammer (the brain) to twist in a screw (math). LLMs are discovering a lot of new math because they are great at low depth high breadth situations. I predict that in the future people will ditch LLMs in favor of AlphaGo style RL done on Lean syntax trees. These should be a…

> AI will win a fields medal before being able to manage a McDonald's Of course, because it takes multi-modal intelligence to manage a McDonalds. I.e. it requires human intelligence. > I predict that in the future people will ditch LLMs in favor of AlphaGo style RL Same for coding as well. LLM's might be the interface we use with other forms of AI though.

Something like building Linux is more akin to managing a McDonald's than it is to a 10 page technical proof in Algebraic Groups.

Programming is more multimodal than math.

Something like performance engineering might be free lunch though

Re: Further human + AI + proof assistant work on Knuth's "Claude Cycles" problem

#54

Post by slopinthebag »

vatsachak wrote: post #49
slopinthebag wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stockfish's power comes from mostly search, and the ML techniques it uses are mainly about better search, i.e. pruning branches more efficiently.

The weights must still have some understanding of the chess board. Though there is always the chance that it makes no sense to us

Even that is probably too much. It has no understanding of what "chess" is, or what a chess board is, or even what a game is. And yet it crushes every human with ease. It's pretty nuts haha.

Re: Further human + AI + proof assistant work on Knuth's "Claude Cycles" problem

#56

Post by smithcoin »

When I was younger I remember a point of demarcation for me was learning the 4chan adage “trolls trolling trolls”, and approaching all internet interactions with skepticism. While I have been sure that Reddit for a while has succumbed to being “dead internet”. This thread is another moment for me- I can no longer recognize who is a bot, and who has honest intentions.

Re: Further human + AI + proof assistant work on Knuth's "Claude Cycles" problem

#57

Post by hollerith »

vatsachak wrote: post #49
slopinthebag wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stockfish's power comes from mostly search, and the ML techniques it uses are mainly about better search, i.e. pruning branches more efficiently.

The weights must still have some understanding of the chess board. Though there is always the chance that it makes no sense to us

Does Stockfish have weights or use a neural net? I know older versions did not.

Re: Further human + AI + proof assistant work on Knuth's "Claude Cycles" problem

#58

Post by [deleted] »

DrewADesign wrote: post #12
dataviz1000 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I got Claude to self reference and update its own instructions to solve making a typed proxy API of any website. After a week, scores of iterations, it can reverse engineer any website. The first few days I had to be deeply involved with each iteration loop. Domain knowledge is helpful. Each time I saw a problem I would ask Claude to update its instructions so it doesn't happen again. Then less and less. Eventually i…

> I went to the coffeeshop and drank very good coffee listening to music. Then at night I sat and had a beer thinking about T.S. Eliot's 'The Wasteland', the effect of industrialization in England at that time and his views of how ennui affected the aristocracy. Well, for those among us that are not aristocracy already, except for the vanishingly small number of people required to oversee such processes, we’re probab…

[deleted]

Re: Further human + AI + proof assistant work on Knuth's "Claude Cycles" problem

#59

Post by slopinthebag »

vatsachak wrote: post #53
slopinthebag wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> AI will win a fields medal before being able to manage a McDonald's Of course, because it takes multi-modal intelligence to manage a McDonalds. I.e. it requires human intelligence. > I predict that in the future people will ditch LLMs in favor of AlphaGo style RL Same for coding as well. LLM's might be the interface we use with other forms of AI though.

Something like building Linux is more akin to managing a McDonald's than it is to a 10 page technical proof in Algebraic Groups. Programming is more multimodal than math. Something like performance engineering might be free lunch though

Yeah, it's hard to compare management and programming but they're both multimodal in very different ways. But there's gonna be entire domains in which AI dominates much like stockfish, but stockfish isn't managing franchises and there is no reason to expect that anytime soon.

I feel like something people miss when they talk about intelligence is that humans have incredible breadth. This is really what differentiates us from artificial forms of intelligence as well as other animals. Plus we have agency, the ability to learn, the ability to critically think, from first principles, etc.

Re: Further human + AI + proof assistant work on Knuth's "Claude Cycles" problem

#60

Post by [deleted] »

dataviz1000 wrote: post #5
adrithmetiqa wrote: post #2

Super interesting but what does this mean for us mere mortals?

I got Claude to self reference and update its own instructions to solve making a typed proxy API of any website. After a week, scores of iterations, it can reverse engineer any website. The first few days I had to be deeply involved with each iteration loop. Domain knowledge is helpful. Each time I saw a problem I would ask Claude to update its instructions so it doesn't happen again. Then less and less. Eventually i…

[deleted]
Post reply on HN