Live data from Hacker News

Nobody gets promoted for simplicity

terriblesoftware.org

51–60 of 534 posts

Re: Nobody gets promoted for simplicity

#51
post #39

In larger systems, what looks like “overengineering” can be deliberate risk management. In my experience, senior engineers do get promoted for simplicity but only when they can articulate the trade-offs and the future costs they are avoiding.

this is rare tho

Re: Nobody gets promoted for simplicity

#52
Engineer B who can get that over complex solution working is the person you will turn to when complexity is required for the problem. They have experience in getting it to work, and such they really are worth more.

The real question is how do you tell engineer A who can figure out how to make the complex problems simple from engineer C who can't handle complexity and so writes simple solutions when the complex one is needed.

Re: Nobody gets promoted for simplicity

#53

Sure they do. You just need to spell it out in business terms, not tech terms: "Reduced incidents by 80%", "Decreased costs by 40%", "Increased performance by 33% while decreasing server footprint by 25%" Simplicity for its own sake is not valued. The results of simplicity are highly valued.

You can't measure the impact of not creating a steaming pile of complexity.

Re: Nobody gets promoted for simplicity

#54

Sure they do. You just need to spell it out in business terms, not tech terms: "Reduced incidents by 80%", "Decreased costs by 40%", "Increased performance by 33% while decreasing server footprint by 25%" Simplicity for its own sake is not valued. The results of simplicity are highly valued.

> "Reduced incidents by 80%", "Decreased costs by 40%", "Increased performance by 33% while decreasing server footprint by 25%" My experience is no one really gets promoted/rewarded for these types of things or at least not beyond an initial one-off pat on the back. All anyone cares about is feature release velocity. If it's even possible to reduce incidents by 80% then either your org had a very high tolerance for b…

You can reduce a single type of incident by 80%. The overall incident rate for this particular type wasn't high enough to kill your company, but it's still a big number on your promotion packet.

Re: Nobody gets promoted for simplicity

#55

I’ve definitely consistently seen people who can take a wildly complex bug-ridden Rube Goldberg machine that was impossible to change and break it down into a simple understandable system get promoted. These people are generally the best engineers in the org and a get reputation for that.

where do you work!? lol

Re: Nobody gets promoted for simplicity

#56
I forget who said it, but it seems that AI is basically an amplifier of the talents (or lack of them) of whoever is wielding the tool.

In the hands of an experienced developer/designer, AI will help them achieve a good result faster.

In the hands of someone inexperienced, out of their depth, AI will just help them create a mess faster, and without the skill to assess what's been generated they may not even know it.

Re: Nobody gets promoted for simplicity

#57
Part of this from what I've seen is a large company problem, where developers exist underneath a thick layer of middle management.

In smaller companies it's a lot easier to express the distinctions and values of simplicity to ears that might actually appreciate it (so long as you can translate it into what they value - simple example is pointing out that you produced the same result in much less time, and that you can get more done on overall feature/task level as a result).

Re: Nobody gets promoted for simplicity

#58

AI coding tools are making this problem worse in a subtle way. When an agent can generate a "scalable event-driven architecture" in 5 minutes, the build cost of complexity drops to near zero. But the maintenance cost doesn't. So now you get Engineer B's output even faster, with even more impressive-sounding abstractions, and the promotion packet writes itself in minutes too. Meanwhile the actual cost - debugging, onb…

On the other hand, AI coding tools make it relatively easy to set and apply policies that can help with this sort of thing. I like to have something like the following in AGENTS.md: ## Guiding Principles - Optimise for long-term maintainability - KISS - YAGNI

Not sure if you're kidding or not, but to write great maintable code, you need a lot of understanding that a LLM just doesn't have, like history, business context, company culture etc. Also, I doubt that in it's training data it has a lot of good examples of great maintainable code to pull from.

Re: Nobody gets promoted for simplicity

#59
post #14

I interviewed at a company that used a simple project to screen candidates. It was implementing a cash register checkout system. The task was soo simple that I couldn't figure out what they were looking for. So I implemented the simplest thing possible. I got the job partially because they were impressed by my utterly simple solution. I helped evaluate other candidates given the exact same problem and it's amazing ho…

i think you can coach agents to build simple solutions in a simple way. I'm using amp rn so check back in 6 mo with me

Re: Nobody gets promoted for simplicity

#60
> In design reviews, when someone asks “shouldn’t we future-proof this?”, don’t just cave and go add layers.

In fact, simplicity often is the best future-proofing. Complex designs come with maintenance costs, so simple designs are inherently more robust to reorgs, shifted priorities, and team downsizing.

Post reply on HN