I was completely caught off-guard, because initially I read the headline as "ASMR of firing 1,700 people, mostly managers" which I would listen to
ASML staffing changes could result in a net reduction of around 1700 positions
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Re: ASML staffing changes could result in a net reduction of around 1700 positions
#52> ASML also announced a new share buyback programme of up to €12 billion, to be executed by 31 December 2028. Oh boy. This fills me with dread. I've never seen a company that starts doing buybacks not become a financialized hollow shell within a decade. Being an irreplaceable monopoly on the commanding heights of the digital economy makes this even worse.
ASML did two extremely big bets on the future. Both futures are now.
And they can look forward too, their order book has tens of billions in there for the coming years. And that's orders, on top of that comes the maintenance and support for all the machines in operation - in 2023 they delivered 449 machines (not just their top of the line stuff), which means that there's thousands of machines in operation requiring regular maintenance etc.
ASML's bet paid off and for now at least their business is very sustainable.
Re: ASML staffing changes could result in a net reduction of around 1700 positions
#53May be the word is used somewhat differently across the world. But I assume this isn't "Firing" but actually "laid off" ?
You could say it is restructuring, eliminate positions or laid off but firing to me means something very different.
Re: ASML staffing changes could result in a net reduction of around 1700 positions
#54Guys, is the current narrative that, due to AI, pure engineering is gone and we’re all supposed to be “managers”, or is it the other way around? I kinda lost the plot here.
Magically, spending money on datacenters and gear makes working code fantastically appear from the aether and so engineers can be paid the same as janitors. That's what the suits believe now.
They can believe whatever they want but the reality will hit them soon enough.
Re: ASML staffing changes could result in a net reduction of around 1700 positions
#55ASML understands what most big companies don't. If you don't reach your targets it's not the engineers fault. It's bad management ;)
ASML just set revenue records and its stock is surging due to the Q4 results
Which is mostly the result of clever engineers that produced a machine no other company in the world can assemble, but that is absolutely crucial to businesses valued at double-digit trillions of dollars.
You don't really need an army of sales managers to sell such a product. Going lean on management and more heavy on engineering is therefore a good idea if you want to keep the lead you have.
Re: ASML staffing changes could result in a net reduction of around 1700 positions
#56Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's a mechanism to distribute profits to shareholders. Do you invest in companies that don't distribute profits - does this get you some kind of higher return?
From the company perspective, performing buyback when market is high is just throwing cash by the windows to over-priced shares. If they wanted to distribute cash, they could just use dividends
Dividends and capital gains have different treatment in a number of tax codes. In the UK for example when you have high income the dividend marginal tax is 39.35% but CGT only 24% with a higher tax free allowance (500 for dividends 3000 for cgt)
Re: ASML staffing changes could result in a net reduction of around 1700 positions
#57Wonder if China will make some of them offers?
Possibly, but there's no-compete clauses (which are hard to enforce), plus these are mostly managers, not engineers, definitely not engineers that have the deeper knowledge of the systems.
But even the knowledge on its own is enough - after all, a lot of that is in published scientific papers already. ASML works because they combined everything. China can't just build a copy of their EUV machines without also having a copy of their suppliers.
Re: ASML staffing changes could result in a net reduction of around 1700 positions
#58Guys, is the current narrative that, due to AI, pure engineering is gone and we’re all supposed to be “managers”, or is it the other way around? I kinda lost the plot here.
As I understand it, white-collar work at all levels is eliminated, as are creative pursuits (art, music, etc), and we can finally return to humanity's true calling - manual labour.
Re: ASML staffing changes could result in a net reduction of around 1700 positions
#59The press release ( https://www.asml.com/en/news/press-releases/2026/strengtheni... ) seems remarkably to the point, for CEO press release standards. I'm impressed by their ambition to fire 1700 managers (!) That's a lot of managers! I interviewed with ASML a decade and a half ago and while there was plenty to complain about (eg their tens of millions of lines of absolutely unmaintainable C code), I didn't feel at th…
I want to say "it's because they're Dutch lol" but it's signed by Cristophe (Fouquet), who is French. 1700 managers is a lot, but also, it's a huge multinational so I'm not surprised they have that many. They will be alright I'm sure - one, if there's any forced firings they will be well taken care of under Dutch labour laws, and two, ASML will look very good on a CV.
> any forced firings they will be well taken care of under Dutch labour laws
Yes. Notice period stays in tact. Transition payment is 1/3rd of a monthly wage per year worked. And then your unemployment runs for up to 24 months at 70% of your income capped at €4500. Unemployment benefits are unconditional until you find a new job.
Re: ASML staffing changes could result in a net reduction of around 1700 positions
#60Can someone explain, why this is done? I get a feeling, it's normally done when a company is in trouble or will soon? But they should have more money than ever. They say it is to focus on innovation, but if you are a smart young person in NL, would you want to work where they just fired 1700 people? And if you already work there and are a top player it is a good time to rethink? A company I know wanted to focus, inst…
I worked for a company that went through 2 cycles like this and I can report that it had zero effect on us engineers.
My impression was that people were constantly being promoted into management and at some point we just had too many managers and that's why it was done. Of course, when you know this, the question becomes: why allow things to get to this point in the first place?