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On Being a Human Being in the Time of Collapse (2022) [pdf]

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Re: On Being a Human Being in the Time of Collapse (2022) [pdf]

#51

Post by fc417fc802 »

AlecSchueler wrote: post #43
GardenLetter27 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMO the issue is not propaganda at all, but real physical problems that are not being addressed. Western governments have been mostly incapable of building housing and infrastructure. We have a severe housing shortage, barely improved public transport since the 80s, a lack of energy production (in Europe), lack of reservoirs, an aging population and increased international competition, etc. And this all creates a hug…

> Western governments have been mostly incapable of building housing and infrastructure. The reason we need non stop housing construction is because the underlying issue is capitalism's demand for infinite growth.

That doesn't really make sense. The population in most of the west is vaguely around replacement. A given individual can only make use of so much housing at once. Sure if you're rolling in cash throw in a vacation home or two. There's a pretty quick falloff in terms of utility, status, desire, any metric that's coming to mind as I type this.

It seems to me that at least in the US the issue is location. There's cheap stock in places without jobs and ridiculously expensive stock where the good jobs are located. It doesn't have to be this way.

Re: On Being a Human Being in the Time of Collapse (2022) [pdf]

#52

Post by jcbrand »

AlecSchueler wrote: post #43
GardenLetter27 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMO the issue is not propaganda at all, but real physical problems that are not being addressed. Western governments have been mostly incapable of building housing and infrastructure. We have a severe housing shortage, barely improved public transport since the 80s, a lack of energy production (in Europe), lack of reservoirs, an aging population and increased international competition, etc. And this all creates a hug…

> Western governments have been mostly incapable of building housing and infrastructure. The reason we need non stop housing construction is because the underlying issue is capitalism's demand for infinite growth.

It's not capitalism that requires infinite growth, it's our current monetary system.

New money is created by lending it into existence, with interest.

That last bit is key. In order to pay off the interest, you need money, which was also loaned into existence with interest.

The only way to maintain this is through constant economic growth. Without it there's a deflationary collapse.

Re: On Being a Human Being in the Time of Collapse (2022) [pdf]

#54

Post by oddmade »

arethuza wrote: post #23
goatlover wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who is responsible for these sustained propaganda campaigns? Some of it is foreign interference looking to destabilize, but a lot of it is sponsored by wealthy individuals whose interests are a lot different than the average person, and whose opinions are sheltered from the realities of ordinary life.

"There’s class warfare, all right, but it’s my class, the rich class, that’s making war, and we’re winning." Warren Buffet https://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/26/business/yourmoney/26ever...

THIS

Re: On Being a Human Being in the Time of Collapse (2022) [pdf]

#55

Post by bratbag »

OKRainbowKid wrote: post #12
cheschire wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It must be quite depressing to live life always wondering what could have been.

Not as depressing as life in a world where nobody ever stops to reflect.

Or a life where everyone operates in absolutes, with no shades of grey allowed.

Zero reflection and total constant analysis paralysis are both non viable.

Re: On Being a Human Being in the Time of Collapse (2022) [pdf]

#56

Post by fc417fc802 »

watwut wrote: post #26
GardenLetter27 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMO the issue is not propaganda at all, but real physical problems that are not being addressed. Western governments have been mostly incapable of building housing and infrastructure. We have a severe housing shortage, barely improved public transport since the 80s, a lack of energy production (in Europe), lack of reservoirs, an aging population and increased international competition, etc. And this all creates a hug…

That does not explain radicalization and anti-democratic turn of billionaires. Ordinary people who are turning fascists are not turning fascists because of economic anxiety. They reject party that make economy better.

> They reject party that make economy better.

I didn't realize there was a cut and dry "correct" answer. Has it occurred to you that perhaps you are subject to similar biases as other people without being aware of it?

Re: On Being a Human Being in the Time of Collapse (2022) [pdf]

#57

Post by rsp1984 »

grunder_advice wrote: post #9

Pretty much all western countries are experiencing a crisis of democracy. It seems to me that the biggest contributor to this is the vulnerability of the electorate. It seems to me that it has become possible to hijack the minds of individuals with sustained propaganda campaigns. You have individuals who at best completely a BSc in Business Studies, and you are asking them to decide on COVID or climate change. That b…

The boring but true answer is that the only thing people should be protesting for is a change of the electoral law. Everything else is downstream of that.

In the US, it's a de-facto duopoly on power, held up by a number of "winner-takes-all" rules. Politicians of either party will do everything in their power to keep "outsiders" (i.e. people/parties that are not entrenched in the two-party system and might actually drive positive change) from ever gaining a foothold.

In Germany it's the famous 5% rule that virtually ensures that every new party must maximize populism or perish.

I'm sure it's very similar in most other "democratic" countries.

Laws aren't perfect. In fact they often are buggy as hell. The electoral law is certainly no exception. However it is ultimately the law that matters most as it determines who can raise to power and who can't. Ensuring it fair and democratic should be the #1 civic duty.

Re: On Being a Human Being in the Time of Collapse (2022) [pdf]

#58

Post by bell-cot »

AlecSchueler wrote: post #43
GardenLetter27 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMO the issue is not propaganda at all, but real physical problems that are not being addressed. Western governments have been mostly incapable of building housing and infrastructure. We have a severe housing shortage, barely improved public transport since the 80s, a lack of energy production (in Europe), lack of reservoirs, an aging population and increased international competition, etc. And this all creates a hug…

> Western governments have been mostly incapable of building housing and infrastructure. The reason we need non stop housing construction is because the underlying issue is capitalism's demand for infinite growth.

Millennia before Adam Smith was born, pretty much every human societies which built "houses" (be they crude tents, igloos, lean-tos, thatched huts, or whatever) made a point of building enough of those to house all their members.

Capitalism has financialized housing, and that seems to be a major cause of the "can't actually build housing" problem.

Re: On Being a Human Being in the Time of Collapse (2022) [pdf]

#59

Post by czechonetwo »

tomaytotomato wrote: post #4

I think its a pessimistic outlook and I agree with the sentiment, but then I switch back to objectively how humanity has been historically and how far we have come, I can't stop thinking, "wow". Being in my 30s I remember Y2K, OZone layer diminishing and a rogue comet coming to wipe out humanity, but it didn't. This is survivor bias just like the examples in the lecture around wildfires and Covid are surely survivor…

> My engineer brain says lets pick up the poo and then look at solutions to stop it happening again.

The people that put up the “no pee or poo” signs in the yard have dead bushes from dog urine.

Dogs pee and poo, dogs are good companions, you shouldn’t get rid of dogs or their people, there will always be dogs, resistance to pee and poo are futile.

Re: On Being a Human Being in the Time of Collapse (2022) [pdf]

#60

Post by _heimdall »

lazide wrote: post #11
voxleone wrote: post #6

Helping, in Rogaway’s sense, means refusing both neutrality and despair. Collapse is not an excuse for nihilism; there are still objective ways to help, even if they’re costly and uncertain. That looks like rejecting work that accelerates surveillance, extraction, or environmental damage; pushing back inside institutions; redirecting skills toward public-interest, climate, or civic work; and engaging politically rath…

The issue is how much of the helping is a trap. Helping someone who refuses to deal with the underlying behaviors causing the real problem is just wasting energy better spent on other things. Taken to an extreme, it’s being a martyr.

What you're describing perfectly describes our modern medical system. We define disease only by symptoms and as symptoms arise we paper over them with some combination of pills and surgery. There's never time made to understand the underlying cause, only how to patch up symptoms and send the patient home.
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