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Oral microbiome sequencing after taking probiotics

blog.booleanbiotech.com

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Re: Oral microbiome sequencing after taking probiotics

#51

Post by CGMthrowaway »

agumonkey wrote: post #29
CGMthrowaway wrote: post #10

PSA: If a probiotic is on the shelf, not in a cooler, it's probably not worth buying. The best companies certify the count of organisms at time of manufacture , but no counts are guaranteed at the shelf. Probiotics are living organisms and ought to be refrigerated for max lifespan. You can get refrigerated probiotic supps at a place like Whole Foods. Source: I used to work in the industry.

what kind of cooler, near zero or just yogurt level temperatures ?

Freezing has potential to cause damage to the organisms, safer to refrigerate (and consume asap)

Re: Oral microbiome sequencing after taking probiotics

#52

Post by cwnyth »

xattt wrote: post #32
Enginerrrd wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also frankly, doctor =/= expert on probiotics. None of their training really addresses that and while they might be more qualified to read research than random layman I would not in general ascribe authority to what a random practitioner has to say about probiotics. Frankly, the research on probiotics is still very much in its infancy and a LOT remains to be figured out.

> doctor =/= expert on probiotics Medical microbiologists would love to have a word with you. Medicine and medicine-adjacent disciplines each develop institutional knowledge that percolates from each specialized discipline. > …the research on probiotics is still very much in its infancy and a LOT remains to be figured out. I’m curious who you think does the research. It’s certainly not Bubba from down the creek.

PhDs do the research. Not your typical overworked family practitioner.

Re: Oral microbiome sequencing after taking probiotics

#53

Post by ahstilde »

bzmrgonz wrote: post #18

I want this for nasal microbiome. I think modern living is wreaking havoc on our upper respiratory track. We need to find a way to regenerate or improve nasal cavity microbiome.

I think your best bet is first curing your allergies. That's what I've been working on for 5 years: www.wyndly.com

Re: Oral microbiome sequencing after taking probiotics

#54

Post by ac29 »

CGMthrowaway wrote: post #10

PSA: If a probiotic is on the shelf, not in a cooler, it's probably not worth buying. The best companies certify the count of organisms at time of manufacture , but no counts are guaranteed at the shelf. Probiotics are living organisms and ought to be refrigerated for max lifespan. You can get refrigerated probiotic supps at a place like Whole Foods. Source: I used to work in the industry.

> The best companies certify the count of organisms at time of manufacture

The best companies certify the viable count at expiration, I've seen many that do.

There is a difference between probiotics in live culture and shelf stable products but both can be viable methods of delivery.

Re: Oral microbiome sequencing after taking probiotics

#55

Post by ac29 »

ungreased0675 wrote: post #31
monkpit wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, feeding good bacteria is the best bet. Probiotics are transient, they don’t colonize.

How do they get there initially?

The environment we live in and the foods we eat are hardly sterile.

There is also a significant microbiome on your skin.

Re: Oral microbiome sequencing after taking probiotics

#56

Post by zamadatix »

CGMthrowaway wrote: post #48
zamadatix wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I asked my doctor about which kinds of probiotics are most effective she specifically mentioned refrigerated vs non-refrigerated is not a way to identify quality or effectiveness unless you know the specific strain(s) needed cannot be made shelf-stable. This lined up with asking my endodontist after they prescribed some antibiotics for a tooth infection. They did warn that the use by dates are a bit bull, not to…

>self-sourced It's not "self-sourced" whatever that means (like that's a bad thing per se?). I saw the sausage being made and I spoke to the sausage makers. The source is the sausage makers, not me. Sorry I don't have a link. These facts may or may not be trade secrets.

"Self-sourced" as in both of our comments are hearsay: we say we heard this information from someone and our source for that is only us saying so. That's pretty bad in terms of what others can actually do with that information (from either of our comments). Not just because hearsay can be faked, but more because it's unquestionable, untestable, and the quality of the information has almost always greatly degraded compared to the source.

This doesn't mean the comments should be assumed to be false any more than they should be assumed to be true. It also doesn't imply we necessarily have some way to provide an actual source either. Just that folks will have to go elsewhere if they want any certainty about this information, since we didn't provide any as random usernames on a message board saying we heard something before.

Re: Oral microbiome sequencing after taking probiotics

#57

Post by zdragnar »

CGMthrowaway wrote: post #49
zdragnar wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a difference between "choosing one over the other" and the original claim of shelf stabilized probiotics being not worth buying. On a few occasions when my dog has gotten sick, or needed antibiotics, shelf stabilized probiotics cleaned their digestion right up. Are strains that only survive when refrigerated probably a higher count? Maybe. Are there stains that are better but can't be freeze dried? Probably.…

I never denied any of that. Read my comment again, more carefully.

The very first line of your comment:

> PSA: If a probiotic is on the shelf, not in a cooler, it's probably not worth buying.

is exactly what I was responding to, along with your one word response "Yes" to that applying equally to all bacterial strains, which is also untrue.

Re: Oral microbiome sequencing after taking probiotics

#58

Post by [deleted] »

CGMthrowaway wrote: post #23
temp0826 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are some newer types of probiotics (called "spore-based") which claim better shelf stability (don't require refrigeration) and resistance (to populate further down the digestive system). But you're absolutely right, they tend to die off pretty quickly (be extra weary of ordering them online, especially during the summer if they're going to sit around in a hot delivery truck or mailbox!).

That is more around solving a different problem than shelf-stability, which is the fact that most probiotics targeting the intestines don't survive in great measure beyond the stomach.

[deleted]

Re: Oral microbiome sequencing after taking probiotics

#59

Post by inglor_cz »

bzmrgonz wrote: post #18

I want this for nasal microbiome. I think modern living is wreaking havoc on our upper respiratory track. We need to find a way to regenerate or improve nasal cavity microbiome.

Nasal rinsing may help. In my case, it reduced my number of colds per year from 6 to approx. 1, and they also tend to be milder. This was likely accompanied by some change in nasal microbiome as well.

Re: Oral microbiome sequencing after taking probiotics

#60

Post by OutOfHere »

cluckindan wrote: post #27
OutOfHere wrote: post #12

Wasn't there recently a discussion of a risk of methanol formation from an ethanol producing strain? I sure hope that none of your strains produce ethanol.

Why not? Ethanol kills competing bacteria and is only produced in microscopic quantities. Methanol is produced by a lot of bacteria, almost every human produces it within their body.

Isn't methanol a strong poison? I do not believe that any probiotic or native strains produce it.

Chemically the problem with ethanol is that it's too close to methanol.

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