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Coursera's Functional Programming - Cheating Discovered

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Re: Coursera's Functional Programming - Cheating Discovered

#51

Post by AdamFernandez »

Permit wrote: post #31

I'm of the opinion that the value of Coursera's courses comes from the learning opportunity, not the certification. I think they should simply allow cheating and not issue certificates. Alternatively, allow cheating and continue to issue certificates while letting employers decide the true value of the certificates. The point of Coursera (to me) isn't to pad my resume, it's to learn from courses not always offered at…

Some would argue that the point of Coursera is to offer education to those who cannot afford it or access it through traditional means. If I come from a poor community anywhere in the world, but have internet access, this certificate means quite a bit to me in terms of employment and opportunities (not just as a resume pad). I think for this reason alone your second alternative is more fair. Obviously, Coursera also helps to augment someone's existing knowledge, or as an educational source for a hobbyist.

Re: Coursera's Functional Programming - Cheating Discovered

#52

Post by nanijoe »

edw519 wrote: post #42

Actually, this is valuable data. As a potential employer, I care more about the candidate's ethics (or lack thereof) than their ability. I could always teach them, but I could never trust them. Coursera should just publicly identify cheaters so I can cross check against resumes or certifications. Problem solved.

Problem solved only if ALL of cousera's students need to be employed by you.

Re: Coursera's Functional Programming - Cheating Discovered

#53

Post by papsosouid »

readme wrote: post #13
cimi_ wrote: post #8

The certificates, IMHO, are meaningless in the context of these online courses. Considering this, I find the measure exaggerated. I use github as a central place to store almost everything I write outside work, so it comes pretty natural for me to version code for problems I've been working on there. Disclaimer: I'm not involved in the Scala course, so I don't know how the actual assigments were structured.

The certificates will have value as long as they remain evidence of honest completion of the course. To say they are worthless is kind of short-sighted. Considering the number of tech resumes in the typical hiring manager's inbox that contain a laundry-list of programming languages in the skills section and not even a single project or course to prove the knowledge of the candidate, I'd say there is a fairly large do…

>Given two resumes, one with a big bullet list of unverified skills, and one with a bullet list of some completed coursera courses, which would you choose?

The big problem with your logic is assuming that one of these two options must be meaningful. Those two resumes are either both good enough to bring in for an interview, or both not good enough to bring in for an interview. "I have a worthless piece of paper" changes nothing.

Re: Coursera's Functional Programming - Cheating Discovered

#54

Post by namank »

riffraff wrote: post #37
blindhippo wrote: post #28

If it's this easy to "cheat" on these assignments, then maybe the professors should sit down and think about how to properly craft assignments. It's clear to me that traditional assignment grading will not work in an online/anonymous environment - appealing to a code of honor will not help if they want the certificate of completion to actually hold meaning. I don't have any actual suggestions other then when I was in…

actually, when I took the first "not-quite-coursera" classes (ML and DB) they did quizzes in a smarter way[0], using a larger set of questions per quiz than the stuff you'd get in a single attempt. So each attempt, even from the same student, would get a slightly different set of questions, and the dumbest attempts at cheating were discouraged[1]. I don't see why this couldn't be done for the programming assingments.…

I know there is one class on Coursera doing exactly that. The reason was to allow students multiple attempts at quizzes - have a bank for 20 questions where only 10 get asked.

Re: Coursera's Functional Programming - Cheating Discovered

#55

Post by nicksergeant »

namank wrote: post #50
edw519 wrote: post #42

Actually, this is valuable data. As a potential employer, I care more about the candidate's ethics (or lack thereof) than their ability. I could always teach them, but I could never trust them. Coursera should just publicly identify cheaters so I can cross check against resumes or certifications. Problem solved.

Lol, thats harsh. Everyone makes mistakes, everyone slips. Making mistakes is an integral part of iterating towards the better.

"Cheating" is not "making a mistake".

Re: Coursera's Functional Programming - Cheating Discovered

#57

Post by jopt »

namank wrote: post #50
edw519 wrote: post #42

Actually, this is valuable data. As a potential employer, I care more about the candidate's ethics (or lack thereof) than their ability. I could always teach them, but I could never trust them. Coursera should just publicly identify cheaters so I can cross check against resumes or certifications. Problem solved.

Lol, thats harsh. Everyone makes mistakes, everyone slips. Making mistakes is an integral part of iterating towards the better.

That's just crazy. Whether or not cheaters should be exposed, I hope that mistakes bit is not your general policy for anything.

Re: Coursera's Functional Programming - Cheating Discovered

#58

Post by PhantomLobe »

jiggy2011 wrote: post #32

So, what exactly is the point in cheating on these assignments? IIRC there is no academic credit available and all you receive is a non accredited certificate. Surely the only point in doing the assignments in the first place is to satisfy yourself that you have understood and can apply the material?

The point is that some people accepted they wouldn't do something, but they did. Rules broken = cheating.

Re: Coursera's Functional Programming - Cheating Discovered

#59

Post by blaines »

edw519 wrote: post #42

Actually, this is valuable data. As a potential employer, I care more about the candidate's ethics (or lack thereof) than their ability. I could always teach them, but I could never trust them. Coursera should just publicly identify cheaters so I can cross check against resumes or certifications. Problem solved.

It's possible students (ignorantly) made their work public because they were proud of their accomplishments. I've done that once or twice under the assumption the course would change for other classes, if only slightly.

That being said, the onus is on the student to make sure they aren't submitting someone's work as their own. I'm not really sure if they understood what they were doing was serious (as in if Coursera was just a bunch of robot drones and they didn't give it much credibility). I know this incident legitimizes Coursera (and it's certificates of completion) in my eyes.

Really I believe all they need to say is, "Look, we really put a lot of work into this to make a good experience for people. We'd appreciate it if you took your answers offline and help make Coursera a respectable name in learning by submitting original work". The whole "We'll start expelling!" doesn't really strike a chord with me. I've been expelled before [not from coursera] for really dumb reasons.

# ALSO, they should take their Honor code out of the ToS. Put it somewhere that people READ!

Re: Coursera's Functional Programming - Cheating Discovered

#60

Post by dkhenry »

vyrotek wrote: post #30
mikecaron wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but if it's against school policy, the school has the right to expel you. Coursera is not taking the public code down, the owner is, at the coercion of the school. The student is making a value decision: continue the course or take my code down. If you can't play by the rules, you can't be in the game. I think there's a unique opportunity for GitHub here. They could give an educational license to verified stude…

BitBucket offers free private repos. https://bitbucket.org/plans Edit- Apparently BitBucket launched a new version of their site only moments after sharing this link. Looks great!

Thats what I have been using for this course. Bit bucket lets me have unlimited private repos. ( woot bitbucket )
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