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USDA Threatens Stores Giving Discounts to People on Food Stamps

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Re: USDA Threatens Stores Giving Discounts to People on Food Stamps

#51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Forbidding charging SNAP recipients more is reasonable. Why is it reasonable to forbid charging SNAP recipients less?

I think you have to ask why you'd want grocery stores to compete over SNAP customers in a way that doesn't already overlap with how they compete over non-SNAP customers.

Do you have a specific concern? State it.

Re: USDA Threatens Stores Giving Discounts to People on Food Stamps

#52
post #6

Read the article and then you'll put away your pitchforks. A basic rule is snap recipients can't be treated differently than non-program members which seems reasonable. "At issue is SNAP’s “Equal Treatment Rule,” which bars stores from either discriminating against people in the program or offering them favorable treatment. "

No, don’t put your pitchforks anywhere. Trump has spelled it out plain as day: SNAP recipients will starve until Democrats submit -- and that’s basically a direct quote. (https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-says-snap-benefits-wi...) Just today, he declared that he would ignore the court order to release SNAP funds. So it should be pretty obvious why the USDA is making angry noises about this issue in particular. It's an incredibly fucked up form of leverage.

Re: USDA Threatens Stores Giving Discounts to People on Food Stamps

#53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the threat is effective now What is the actual threat? Assuming a grocery chain ignores the interpretation, what troubles could they face?

Banning from the EBT program, civil fines, and, potentially, criminal charges (I’m not sure you can wedge discounts for SNAP beneficiaries into any of the criminal violation categories though it seems like if you did it for cash purchases by SNAP beneficiaries as a way of trying to help deal with the suspension or reduction of SNAP benefits, it could probably be argued to be indirect trafficking—using SNAP payments t…

They don't need a good legal argument to just have border patrol ransack the place and stuff a bunch of customers & employees in detention for a week. We haven't seen (afaik) this sort of vindictive not-even-pretending use of ICE/BP yet but it's right around the corner.

Re: USDA Threatens Stores Giving Discounts to People on Food Stamps

#54
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It a consumer protection and fair competition thing (and probably anti-fraud too). There are similar rules in place for medicare/medicaid too. Gifts of any kind to induce a patient to choose your facility over any other are forbidden. That's why if you look really closely at ads at pharmacies encouraging Medicare/Medicaid people to switch, even though they talk about all these free things, they're all things that are…

> There are similar rules in place for medicare/medicaid too. And yet the Medicare/Medicaid reimbursement rates for services often differs from that of insured, and cash patients...

That has nothing to do with what the provider does or doesn’t charge. The government gets to pick what their reimbursement rate is.

Re: USDA Threatens Stores Giving Discounts to People on Food Stamps

#55

I am conflicted a little on all of this. EBT etc should in most cases temporary, outside of disabled, elderly, and children. I would like to see more of that money going to school meals, lunch and breakfast. Feed the kids directly, with another amount going to parents. Ia that feasible? Is there any way to insure kids are being taken care of?

Why do you think people outside of disabled, elderly, and children and without the income to feed themselves shouldn't get a (frankly modest) benefit allowing them to eat?

Re: USDA Threatens Stores Giving Discounts to People on Food Stamps

#56
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It a consumer protection and fair competition thing (and probably anti-fraud too). There are similar rules in place for medicare/medicaid too. Gifts of any kind to induce a patient to choose your facility over any other are forbidden. That's why if you look really closely at ads at pharmacies encouraging Medicare/Medicaid people to switch, even though they talk about all these free things, they're all things that are…

Switching grocers does not require registration. Many people shop multiple grocers even.

Neither does switching pharmacies. You can today go to 3 different pharmacies and fill 3 different prescriptions as long as you actually have those prescriptions sent to those pharmacies.

Re: USDA Threatens Stores Giving Discounts to People on Food Stamps

#57

Relevant links: https://www.fns.usda.gov/snap/ebt/retailer/retailer-notice/r... https://www.fns.usda.gov/snap/fr-022124 > Coupons shall be accepted for eligible foods at the same prices and on the same terms and conditions applicable to cash purchases of the same foods at the same store except that tax shall not be charged on eligible foods purchased with coupons. Obviously lawyers are going to be involved in interpr…

Lots of anti-kickback / fraud regulations don't require an immediate exchange in order for it to still be a violation, just that you are getting special treatment for having / being part of the group covered by the regulation. Walgreens will get in trouble with the feds for giving you a $10 gift card to switch your prescriptions over to them as a Medicare patient, regardless of whether or not you actually have Medicare part D or whether you actually have Walgreens fill your scripts. It's likely going to be a similar thing here.

Re: USDA Threatens Stores Giving Discounts to People on Food Stamps

#58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've still got my pitchfork out. As the reminder says, discounts are allowed with a USDA waiver, so they should either offer a temporary blanket waiver or suggest some better way to mitigate the impact on SNAP recipients.

> they should either offer a temporary blanket waiver or suggest some better way to mitigate the impact on SNAP recipients Without something like this, why should one assume good faith behind the change? The people chanting "the cruelty is the point" seem to be vindicated rather clearly.

What change? Regardless of why the USDA decided to remind people of this, these rules on SNAP benefits and equal treatment have been part of the law since before Trump took office.

Re: USDA Threatens Stores Giving Discounts to People on Food Stamps

#59
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they should either offer a temporary blanket waiver or suggest some better way to mitigate the impact on SNAP recipients Without something like this, why should one assume good faith behind the change? The people chanting "the cruelty is the point" seem to be vindicated rather clearly.

What change? Regardless of why the USDA decided to remind people of this, these rules on SNAP benefits and equal treatment have been part of the law since before Trump took office.

Funding SNAP during shutdowns with money that is directly set aside for such cases is also part of the law, which Trump is conveniently saying they will not follow. Trying to argue that rules are reasonable doesn't matter when you're trying to make a case while the admin is admitting to starving people for political gain.

Re: USDA Threatens Stores Giving Discounts to People on Food Stamps

#60
It's incredibly disappointing to see HN users flag these stories while the admin is directly admitting to starving people for political gain. It's something that directly and materially impacts me, a tax-paying citizen who has to now spend money out of my savings to support my parents so that they don't starve, who also paid taxes their entire life for these programs to exist and help them.

It's something I literally cannot put my head in the sand to ignore. I would strongly advise others do not ignore it either.

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