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Email immutability matters more in a world with AI

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51–60 of 115 posts

Re: Email immutability matters more in a world with AI

#51
post #2

> The world is changing, and we need to adapt and understand it. fastmail: read my lips: I pay you because you offer a traditional email service if you add a single AI feature I will return to self hosting

Came here to say this. I use fastmail am quite happy with it because I just want a reliable inbox and nothing else. Just keep it running and don't touch anything else.

Re: Email immutability matters more in a world with AI

#52
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Self hosting? I can't even visit simple static web pages without Cloudflare blocking me because my web browser isn't sufficiently trackable. There's no way they're letting self-hosted email messages get through.

This is a myth. I self-host email and don't have deliverability issues. What matters is domain age, IP, and compliance with DKIM/DMARC.

Same here. Self hosting (STMP, DNS, etc) for ~30Y.

Re: Email immutability matters more in a world with AI

#53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And all these services doubling or even trippeling their price to offer the same thing ... but with AI! I'd happily pay fastmail double the price, without the AI.

I genuinely tried to embrace them, but I have found these AI "enhancements" to be utterly useless. Very rare that they can answer the question I'm having about the product. I'm not sure what the norms are for how these assistants are trained or fine tuned for the specific products they're being offered in, but it seems that they're pretty bad. They don't seem to know anything about the product you're using them in.

We ship an AI assistant with our product.

I am attempting to dogfood it, as I am pretty close to the target audience. I, a dev, get a bug report "X doesn't work". I have never heard of "X". Ask the AI assistant instead of Googling it or asking on Slack.

Google's AI overview is basically always better (and delivered sooner) than our own proprietary AI assistant.

Re: Email immutability matters more in a world with AI

#54
post #2

> The world is changing, and we need to adapt and understand it. fastmail: read my lips: I pay you because you offer a traditional email service if you add a single AI feature I will return to self hosting

Tbh I do wish Fastmail would add some kind of automatic email classification like Gmail added many years ago to filter the newsletters out of the important email.

Re: Email immutability matters more in a world with AI

#55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it’s already irrelevant: cryptographic proofs of video evidence is difficult to communicate to audiences while watermarks will be learned by AI as trusted and injected into AI videos anyway. Also, in between the lens and your eyeball is usually a pipeline of editing applied anyway so either the cryptographic signature ends up with every layer signing the modifications applied + the previous layer or you stack…

Communication is a different story, do we know whether it’s possible in the first place? And that requires device integrity.

In theory this is where zero-knowledge proofs can come in. That would allow you to apply transforms to the video (crop, contrast, resize etc) and be able to prove the exact transform that was applied. However it's still computationally expensive.

Re: Email immutability matters more in a world with AI

#56
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Self hosting? I can't even visit simple static web pages without Cloudflare blocking me because my web browser isn't sufficiently trackable. There's no way they're letting self-hosted email messages get through.

This is a myth. I self-host email and don't have deliverability issues. What matters is domain age, IP, and compliance with DKIM/DMARC.

Prove it.

Re: Email immutability matters more in a world with AI

#57

The immutability of documentation tech matters more in a world with AI. The cameras used to document "news" will need to be watermarked, fingerprinted and authenticated, like what Canon and Nikon are already doing (and which AFP has already adopted). It may have seemed gimmicky at first, but in a year or two, you'll probably only be able to trust visuals from companies that do this (wire agencies like AFP, AP and Reu…

By the time the video reaches the end user (i.e. on tiktok and the likes), it will have been re-compressed, edited, meme-ed, voiced over a dozen time. So not sure how you preserve trust in that chain.

Re: Email immutability matters more in a world with AI

#58
post #45
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other hand, this requires locked down devices running trusted apps. Otherwise, such a badge won't have any meaning.

> locked down devices running trusted apps This is a bigger threat than phony AI videos.

To whom? I can imagine starting wars with fake videos.

It's hard to imagine someone kvetching about not being able to sideload apps to their phone reaching that point of significance. I don't mean to completely dismiss very real concerns about what people can and can't do with their purchases, but OTOH war involves actual people actually dying, and manipulating media is a fantastic way to get one.

Re: Email immutability matters more in a world with AI

#59
post #50

Email has never been immutable. Email that you receive on your own server can be trivially altered, it's just a plain text file. In fact until recently email was sent and received in the clear like a postcard, the whole system wasn't designed to be secure or secret in any way.

Immutable as in the message won't be altered/deleted by the sender. This is. This is about user control, as opposed to chat apps or social media, where posts are frequently edited, get taken down after an outrage or links can disappear to link-rot.

From article: "An email is your copy, and the sender can’t revise it later."

Re: Email immutability matters more in a world with AI

#60
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Self hosting? I can't even visit simple static web pages without Cloudflare blocking me because my web browser isn't sufficiently trackable. There's no way they're letting self-hosted email messages get through.

This is a myth. I self-host email and don't have deliverability issues. What matters is domain age, IP, and compliance with DKIM/DMARC.

Is it? Last time I tried to self-host my email I did. I had DKIM, DMARC and SPF set up correctly as verified by multiple sites, but I couldnt't get reliable delivery to any Microsoft-hopsted mailboxes. Every other provider I tested was perfectly happy with my mail, unfortunately MS is too big a provider to ignore them.

> What matters is domain age, IP, and compliance with DKIM/DMARC.

Maybe it was my IP, but I cycled a few with my hosting provider and none of them made a difference. If I am unable to reliable obtain a 'trusted' IP, what good does it do?

I switched to hosted email and all my delivery issues were gone.

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