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Burner Phone 101

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Re: Burner Phone 101

#51

Post by kelnos »

netrap wrote: post #17
tenacious_tuna wrote: post #16

> Radios off (GPS/Wi-Fi/Bluetooth) unless needed GPS is a passive technology, no? Downloading GPS assist data obviously isn't, and plenty of phones use wifi scanning as a way to augment GPS position fixes, but this seemed a strange callout. Am I missing something?

if the phone is confiscated it could be saving GPS automatically, i guess

This stood out from me as odd from the article too, but that's definitely a plausible explanation.

I could easily see a phone with some sort of location tracking saving GPS data points internally until it can reach a network again to send them out.

Re: Burner Phone 101

#52

Post by greesil »

mikeytown2 wrote: post #34

If you need to communicate with people in your area and not be tracked; MeshCore software with LoRa hardware like the this https://lilygo.cc/en-ca/products/t-lora-pager is something to consider. Text only, completely offline

Yes!!! I've been wanting to make something like this for a long time. But unless the firmware is open source I wouldn't trust this for anything secure. But this looks like a dev kit so I can do whatever I want.

Re: Burner Phone 101

#53

Post by reaperducer »

arendtio wrote: post #35
h4ck_th3_pl4n3t wrote: post #2

While I like the sentiment of the article, I think most people are not aware of how hostile baseband firmwares are implemented on most SoCs that phones come with. Usually the cell tower handshakes that make you trackable can't be put off, meaning the modem will run in sleep mode even when you are in airplane mode (which is kinda funny considering the dangers of air travel, right? Right?). Are there actually smartphon…

As far as I remember, the whole 'turn off your phone on a plane' was just a precautionary measure and is not a real technical problem nowadays. The risk was that mobile networks could not handle moving many devices from one cell to another at high speeds (during takeoff and landing).

As far as I remember, the whole 'turn off your phone on a plane' was just a precautionary measure and is not a real technical problem nowadays.

My memory is that it was necessary at the time when lots of people started taking phones on airplanes because the wiring/navigation wasn't shielded against a transmitter that might be actually inside the aircraft.

Since then, plane electronics are better insulated making it less of a problem.

Re: Burner Phone 101

#54

Post by bronco21016 »

supersour wrote: post #40
mikeytown2 wrote: post #34

If you need to communicate with people in your area and not be tracked; MeshCore software with LoRa hardware like the this https://lilygo.cc/en-ca/products/t-lora-pager is something to consider. Text only, completely offline

These look pretty fun, have you played with them much? What kind of range can you get?

I’ve tried them on snowmobile trails. With the vegetation the range was about a mile.

Range can be 100+ miles though if you can establish line of sight. Depending on the scenario, a high elevation repeater could give several mobile devices pretty significant range.

Re: Burner Phone 101

#55

Post by reaperducer »

h4ck_th3_pl4n3t wrote: post #2

While I like the sentiment of the article, I think most people are not aware of how hostile baseband firmwares are implemented on most SoCs that phones come with. Usually the cell tower handshakes that make you trackable can't be put off, meaning the modem will run in sleep mode even when you are in airplane mode (which is kinda funny considering the dangers of air travel, right? Right?). Are there actually smartphon…

Are there actually smartphones without an IMEI and with a Wi-Fi card only, preferrably not a Broadcom one?

Maybe an old iPod Touch that can still run a VOIP program?

Re: Burner Phone 101

#56

Post by dahart »

aja12 wrote: post #10
madethemcry wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you please give any sources? While it sounds plausible and interesting it's nothing more than a wild conspiracy theory without some background information.

Baseband SoC running their own OS independent from Android/iOS and staying asleep (while still listening for incoming signals) is very much no longer in conspiracy theory territory and more an established fact now. I don't have the source at hand but it's in one of the standards. And the purpose is very clear: LEA like Interpol must be able to locate any IMEI at any point if in tower range, regardless of the power st…

I don’t doubt SoCs have their own micro-OS, but I too would love to see a reliable source showing phones connect to towers when powered off. Wouldn’t this, at a minimum, violate FAA/EASA rules? Google tells me the cellular radio in an iPhone has no power when in airplane mode or when off.

Re: Burner Phone 101

#57

Post by dahart »

h4ck_th3_pl4n3t wrote: post #15
pdesi wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even in airplane mode?

I dare you to do the following: Charge phone to full 100%. Turn it off. Put it into a faraday cage, e.g. a steel box, for 7 days. Take it out again and wonder why the battery is empty. (The faraday cage has the effect of making the modem have to switch bands constantly, which costs more electricity than sleep mode in LTE)

Batteries naturally drain slowly when not used. What would this little experiment prove, exactly?

Re: Burner Phone 101

#58

Post by tonyarkles »

reaperducer wrote: post #53
arendtio wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I remember, the whole 'turn off your phone on a plane' was just a precautionary measure and is not a real technical problem nowadays. The risk was that mobile networks could not handle moving many devices from one cell to another at high speeds (during takeoff and landing).

As far as I remember, the whole 'turn off your phone on a plane' was just a precautionary measure and is not a real technical problem nowadays. My memory is that it was necessary at the time when lots of people started taking phones on airplanes because the wiring/navigation wasn't shielded against a transmitter that might be actually inside the aircraft. Since then, plane electronics are better insulated making it l…

There are another two issues that aren’t technical, which are starting to come up again now that Internet access is rapidly becoming available and good onboard aircraft:

- People not paying attention to/ignoring the instructions of the FAs during safety briefings and emergencies due to being engaged in a phone call.

- People being assholes and talking on the phone, bothering the person stuck in the seat next to them.

On all of the flights I’ve been on recently the preflight brief has been crystal clear that you can do whatever you want on the internet connection except have voice calls.

Re: Burner Phone 101

#59

Post by mikeytown2 »

greesil wrote: post #52
mikeytown2 wrote: post #34

If you need to communicate with people in your area and not be tracked; MeshCore software with LoRa hardware like the this https://lilygo.cc/en-ca/products/t-lora-pager is something to consider. Text only, completely offline

Yes!!! I've been wanting to make something like this for a long time. But unless the firmware is open source I wouldn't trust this for anything secure. But this looks like a dev kit so I can do whatever I want.

It's mostly open source. https://github.com/meshcore-dev/MeshCore They have a couple minor things that are paid features.

Re: Burner Phone 101

#60

Post by mikeytown2 »

supersour wrote: post #40
mikeytown2 wrote: post #34

If you need to communicate with people in your area and not be tracked; MeshCore software with LoRa hardware like the this https://lilygo.cc/en-ca/products/t-lora-pager is something to consider. Text only, completely offline

These look pretty fun, have you played with them much? What kind of range can you get?

Range is line of sight. If you can see it, even if 100 miles away, odds are it'll work. Seattle area has one of the better networks for MeshCore. Tacoma to Vancouver BC is the range for semi reliable messaging
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