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Test Results for AMD Zen 5

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Re: Test Results for AMD Zen 5

#51

Post by Sesse__ »

throwaway81523 wrote: post #49
JackYoustra wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any writeups on why they chose this system, whether its still used today, etc? I'm completely unfamiliar with this style of management.

Dunno about writeups but I've worked in that system. Basically the product lifecycle is longer than one product generation. So you get to stay with it through the development, test/release, and maintenance phases, which are arranged to be 2 release cycles. It didn't seem paradoxical or anything. It just made sense.

It depends on having two CPU teams, though. There are not that many teams in the world that can design a high-performance microprocessor; I would assume that AMD has two and Apple has only one (which is why you got all these fillers with just larger and larger M1s in a trenchcoat, while the team was busy trying to make M3 happen).

Re: Test Results for AMD Zen 5

#52

Post by hulitu »

makeitdouble wrote: post #38
varispeed wrote: post #18

Is it better than M4? If a laptop will need to be plugged in to deliver full performance, whilst blasting fans at full throttle, what is the point? (apart from server / workstation use, where you don't like MacOS or need different OS)

Nowadays laptops are majorly used as desktop hybrids. Getting near desktop performance when plugged but portability and lower consumption when unplugged is a pretty good tradeoff.

> Nowadays laptops are majorly used as desktop hybrids.

And they suck big time. And, to add insult to injury, there are also desktops which use laptop CPUs, with the same (lack of) performance.

Re: Test Results for AMD Zen 5

#53

Post by ksec »

hulitu wrote: post #52
makeitdouble wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nowadays laptops are majorly used as desktop hybrids. Getting near desktop performance when plugged but portability and lower consumption when unplugged is a pretty good tradeoff.

> Nowadays laptops are majorly used as desktop hybrids. And they suck big time. And, to add insult to injury, there are also desktops which use laptop CPUs, with the same (lack of) performance.

>And they suck big time.

What sort of work load that sucks big time? Assuming the work load is even laptop focused in the first place.

Re: Test Results for AMD Zen 5

#54

Post by ksec »

Given how Apple's M4 Core can access all of the L2 Cache ( it is shared ) and has a SLC ( System Level Cache ) one could argue it is better to compare it to AMD X3D variant on Cache size. However on Geekbench 6 it is still off by 30-40% per clock. Even if we consider zero performance improvement from M5, it would be a large jump for Zen 6 to catch up.

And that is also the case with Qualcomm's Oryon and ARM's own Cortex X93x series.

Still really looking forward to Zen 6 on server though. I cant wait to see 256 Zen 6c Core.

Re: Test Results for AMD Zen 5

#55

Post by heraldgeezer »

KetoManx64 wrote: post #26
heraldgeezer wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Windows laptops? Desktops for gaming? AMD makes the best gaming CPUs with the X3D series.

What about actually doing something useful to bring prosuctive?

AMD wins over Intel here too.

Most of the workforce use Windows.

You can also use Linux if you want on Intel&AMD.

M CPUs are great but constrained by Apple.

Re: Test Results for AMD Zen 5

#56

Post by varispeed »

makeitdouble wrote: post #38
varispeed wrote: post #18

Is it better than M4? If a laptop will need to be plugged in to deliver full performance, whilst blasting fans at full throttle, what is the point? (apart from server / workstation use, where you don't like MacOS or need different OS)

Nowadays laptops are majorly used as desktop hybrids. Getting near desktop performance when plugged but portability and lower consumption when unplugged is a pretty good tradeoff.

Friend of mine has laptop with Intel Ultra 9 185h. It is always plugged because when you don't plugin in, it is crawling (like even struggles to open Word). Fans are always spinning and it is loud.

For doing any kind of work that requires focus it is an absolute nightmare.

But she need a laptop to occasionally take it to Uni.

Re: Test Results for AMD Zen 5

#57

Post by varispeed »

ksec wrote: post #53
hulitu wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nowadays laptops are majorly used as desktop hybrids. And they suck big time. And, to add insult to injury, there are also desktops which use laptop CPUs, with the same (lack of) performance.

>And they suck big time. What sort of work load that sucks big time? Assuming the work load is even laptop focused in the first place.

Opening Word, more than a few tabs in the browser, that kind of heavy load.

Re: Test Results for AMD Zen 5

#58

Post by bcrl »

ashvardanian wrote: post #5

> All vector units have full 512 bits capabilities except for memory writes. A 512-bit vector write instruction is executed as two 256-bit writes. That sounds like a weird design choice. Curious if this will affect memcpy-heavy workloads. Writes aside, Zen5 is taking much longer to roll out than I thought, and some of AMD's positioning is (almost expectedly) misleading, especially around AI. AMD's website claims Zen5…

It's probably a design choice that is driven by power consumption. 512 bit writes are probably used rarely enough that the performance benefits do not outweigh the additional power consumption that would be borne by all memory writes.

Re: Test Results for AMD Zen 5

#59

Post by kvemkon »

> AMD chips don't have an equivalent to Intel PT. We'd love to add support as soon as they make one. (2022) [1]

> since 2013, Intel offers a feature called "intel processor tracing [2]

> [not answered]

> When will AMD cpus introduce Intel-PT tech or the Intel branch trace store feature? (2024) [3]

> [not answered]

Is Intel-PT over-engineered and not really needed in practice?

[1] https://github.com/janestreet/magic-trace/wiki/How-could-mag...

[2] https://community.amd.com/t5/pc-processors/amd-ipt-intelpt-i...

[3] https://community.amd.com/t5/pc-processors/will-amd-cpus-hav...

Re: Test Results for AMD Zen 5

#60

Post by makeitdouble »

varispeed wrote: post #56
makeitdouble wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nowadays laptops are majorly used as desktop hybrids. Getting near desktop performance when plugged but portability and lower consumption when unplugged is a pretty good tradeoff.

Friend of mine has laptop with Intel Ultra 9 185h. It is always plugged because when you don't plugin in, it is crawling (like even struggles to open Word). Fans are always spinning and it is loud. For doing any kind of work that requires focus it is an absolute nightmare. But she need a laptop to occasionally take it to Uni.

> Intel Ultra 9 185h

The CPU in itself should be pretty good by modern standards: https://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Core+Ultra+9+...

> (like even struggles to open Word).

Her issue is not the form factor. Is it the RAM ? did she activate all the marketing apps ? Is a bitcoin farmer running in the background ? I don't know, but it's worth looking into it.

For comparison, I have at hand a Surface Pro 8 that should be 3x slower than hers on sheer CPU benchmarks, and I can throw any run of mill task at it (do the taxes with 3~4 word documents, Excel, dozens of tabs in firefox and a call session in the background) and it's fine. It will burn trough battery life within an two or three hours under that load, and yes the fans will be running, but I have no issue of having it crawl when unplugged.

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