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Launch HN: K-Scale Labs (YC W24) – Open-Source Humanoid Robots

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Re: Launch HN: K-Scale Labs (YC W24) – Open-Source Humanoid Robots

#52
post #45

>However, a lot of the people who want to buy a humanoid robot today do so because they want a completely autonomous robot to do all their chores, Not sure your research has been through. The ones that get the most attention from what I've seen are the ones that look female. And the first comment is always about how easy to clean... All those lonely men spending thousands on the billion dollar revenue generating only…

Yes, we are aware of this customer segment. I don't think they have thoroughly considered the implications of what high torque actuators can do to the human body

Every technological leap has it's Chuck Yeagers and Yuri Gagarins that will put it all on the line with early tech for humanity to take that next step - we have to accept the inevitable and hope that luck is on these brave soul's side

Re: Launch HN: K-Scale Labs (YC W24) – Open-Source Humanoid Robots

#53
post #44

This is awesome! How much of your team's time goes into working on the physical hardware, versus RL simulation environments, versus managing all the training data from the real robot and the simulations? I'm super interested in learning more about the training process of world and robotics model and the data challenges there.

Thanks! We're all pretty cross-stack - there are some hardware people and some software people, but the product is quite integrated. Personally, my time has been mostly focused on the RL stack recently, and after there are more robots in the wild, I suspect my time will transition to working on building this data feedback loop. I try to answer questions pretty actively on our Discord so happy to chat there about what…

I'll hop in there!

Re: Launch HN: K-Scale Labs (YC W24) – Open-Source Humanoid Robots

#54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> we're open sourcing everything Does/will this include the training data, hyperparams, and weights for the models? People will be reluctant to buy an "open source" robot if the key ML magic to make it work is closed off, e.g. if you charge a subscription for it.

Yeah of course. That's kind of the whole point - I don't think you can really trust a humanoid robot in your house around your family if it is not clear what it's running. Basically, for myself, I would not want to buy a closed sourced humanoid, and I view myself as relatively representative of the early adopter mentality. So personally I think this is the right way to build a great product. I basically believe that…

Love it. It's tough to balance keeping the ship afloat vs giving back to the community, I think you've got a good thing going.

Re: Launch HN: K-Scale Labs (YC W24) – Open-Source Humanoid Robots

#55
Congrats on the launch!

Your current market seems to be "niche toys for rich tech people" and the future market seems very uncertain. I am impressed that you were able to get funding for this idea. How do you get around the "solution in search of a problem (SISP)" objection from VCs? In fact, your founding story indicates that you just liked the technology meaning you had to work backwards to find the business case.

I'm asking because I think many of us would like to get funding for ventures in areas of technology that we are passionate about, but for which the future market potential remains extremely speculative. How do you do it?

Re: Launch HN: K-Scale Labs (YC W24) – Open-Source Humanoid Robots

#57

Nothing against the company but I'm waiting for the tech to get backlash. I have a feeling people are going to want to end the techno autocracy and so-calledb advancements that go on to become weapons while people continue to go back to old ways and learn old skills that prove to more useful.

[flagged]

Re: Launch HN: K-Scale Labs (YC W24) – Open-Source Humanoid Robots

#58
post #45

>However, a lot of the people who want to buy a humanoid robot today do so because they want a completely autonomous robot to do all their chores, Not sure your research has been through. The ones that get the most attention from what I've seen are the ones that look female. And the first comment is always about how easy to clean... All those lonely men spending thousands on the billion dollar revenue generating only…

Yes, we are aware of this customer segment. I don't think they have thoroughly considered the implications of what high torque actuators can do to the human body

You might have a significant portion of those customers that are into that

Re: Launch HN: K-Scale Labs (YC W24) – Open-Source Humanoid Robots

#59
Hey, just chiming in to say that I think this project is really cool even though it's outside the price range of what I can spend on a cool hobby.

I'm disabled, and one thing I'm really interested in long-term for humanoid robots is disability support work. Disability support work involves a huge variety of individual tasks, as many as a typical person will do in their life, so it's a good fit for an extremely general platform like a humanoid robot. Motorised wheelchairs and dishwashers exist, but a support worker might need to push a wheelchair, do sensitive dishes, do laundry, accurately open and place medications without destroying them, weigh & dose powders, help someone with going to the toilet, cook meals, drive a car, control pets, manage the level of noise/light/smells in the environment to stop someone from being overwhelmed, sanitise surfaces including themselves, navigate confusing interfaces on a phone or computer, help someone drink from a bottle, remember what sort of activities helped a disabled person in the past to be able to do them in the future, help someone with physical fitness activities like punching or kicking a pad, talk to people for someone, carry someone safely in the event of an emergency, make coffee in the morning, monitor intake of various drugs/nutrients/macronutrients, be able to reach and catch someone before they hit the floor if they pass out, help someone walk if they're unsteady on their feet, etc etc. It makes sense to me that it would be cost effective to have one platform which can do all of that with similar performance to a human, rather than automating many of those tasks individually in ways that might not be accessible to some disabled people.

In terms of TAM, absolutely huge amounts of money are spent on disability care (keeping in mind that elder care is also disability care), by both governments and private citizens, and this number is forecasted to continue growing as more people become disabled by COVID-19 and demographic changes increase the elderly population relative to working age adults. As well, there are constantly scandals about how bad conditions are in some area of disability care, almost always due to underpaid, untrained, or unmonitored staff, so there's a lot of demand for both more reliable quality & lower prices; that demand is only going to grow with time. Various government bodies are very large sources of funding that are very concerned with value for money and would pursue any option that could do the job without costing as much - in my country (Australia), there's the NDIS, National Disability Insurance Scheme. They are always looking for ways to consolidate care for less money.

I strongly suspect that any humanoid robot which was good enough to do disability support work would be in extremely high demand in the general population for obvious reasons, as well as being useful as a platform for labour automation, but those are much more speculative. Disability support work is a lot of money for incredibly varied tasks being spent right now. Something to think about.

Re: Launch HN: K-Scale Labs (YC W24) – Open-Source Humanoid Robots

#60

Congrats on the launch! Your current market seems to be "niche toys for rich tech people" and the future market seems very uncertain. I am impressed that you were able to get funding for this idea. How do you get around the "solution in search of a problem (SISP)" objection from VCs? In fact, your founding story indicates that you just liked the technology meaning you had to work backwards to find the business case.…

I have a pretty bad mental model of how most VCs think, but I think good VCs will fund smart people who demonstrate extreme conviction, regardless of how they initially size the market. The opportunity cost for me doing K-Scale is making quite a bit of money at Tesla or Meta, so assuming I am not acting irrationally, either I have extreme conviction or I am a masochist. In my experience, VCs are pretty bad at telling the difference.
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