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Fields where Native Americans farmed a thousand years ago discovered in Michigan

smithsonianmag.com

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Re: Fields where Native Americans farmed a thousand years ago discovered in Michigan

#51

Post by firesteelrain »

cvoss wrote: post #47
firesteelrain wrote: post #3

It’s amazing how smart our ancestors were and creative and observant based on amateur science and gardening skills. The amount of planning and organization this must have taken would require a large coordinated effort.

But a farmer is a professional scientist and a professional gardener. Living 1k years ago did not make them uninformed or unskilled at their profession. It's quite a modern bias to suggest this is amateur.

My use of ‘amateur’ was more about how their methods predate formal scientific institutions rather than diminishing their expertise.

Re: Fields where Native Americans farmed a thousand years ago discovered in Michigan

#52

Post by rusk »

romanhn wrote: post #43

For anyone else confused about the three sisters and why they weren't mentioned in the article, it's a reference to this: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Sisters_(agriculture)

Thank you. The other thing I really wanted to know was why they were arranged in mounds/quilt? I’m guessing it relates to irrigation

Re: Fields where Native Americans farmed a thousand years ago discovered in Michigan

#53

Post by alephnerd »

rusk wrote: post #52
romanhn wrote: post #43

For anyone else confused about the three sisters and why they weren't mentioned in the article, it's a reference to this: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Sisters_(agriculture)

Thank you. The other thing I really wanted to know was why they were arranged in mounds/quilt? I’m guessing it relates to irrigation

My hunch (based on how my grandfather would cultivate) was to provide a mount of fertilizer for added nitrogen along with the added irrigation aspects.

It's surprising ("I'm shocked, shocked, well not that shocked") how this style of farming somehow made it all the way to my ancestral village for cultivating these New World crops.

Gotta love proto-globalization.

Re: Fields where Native Americans farmed a thousand years ago discovered in Michigan

#54

Post by ruined »

brookst wrote: post #24
politelemon wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't have imagined broken pottery could serve as compost, how is that made possible? It's clay but it retains some properties even after baking?

Pottery of the time was low-fired and did not generally reach vitrification, and it was not glazed with a silica-based glaze that would seal it. So over time this pottery would absorb water. And especially low-fired bits could totally break down. Source: amateur ceramicist, and I have first-hand experience with cone 6 clay (vitrifies at 1200c) bisc-fired to cone 04 (1060c) and crumbling to bits when left in water too…

to add some context, in modern gardening things like crushed vermiculite are a common soil amendment. being a porous absorbent mineral, it serves the same purpose.

Re: Fields where Native Americans farmed a thousand years ago discovered in Michigan

#55

Post by andy99 »

7thaccount wrote: post #46
bastawhiz wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TIL that earthworms in the American northeast are largely invasive species. That's very surprising to me

Are they problematic though? There were earthworms there before the ice age I think.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invasive_earthworms_of_North...

Also learning about this today. Apparently they're bad for ecosystems that had evolved with slowly decaying organic matter (because they eat it all quickly). In particular forests.

At least in my education they have always been framed as a vital component of the ecosystem and a sign of healthy soil. It's interesting to learn that's not true.

Re: Fields where Native Americans farmed a thousand years ago discovered in Michigan

#56

Post by pfdietz »

andy99 wrote: post #55
7thaccount wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are they problematic though? There were earthworms there before the ice age I think.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invasive_earthworms_of_North... Also learning about this today. Apparently they're bad for ecosystems that had evolved with slowly decaying organic matter (because they eat it all quickly). In particular forests. At least in my education they have always been framed as a vital component of the ecosystem and a sign of healthy soil. It's interesting to learn that's not true.

To some extent it's a matter of definition, and whether being caused by humanity means it's bad. After all, the native earthworms would eventually have migrated north and caused similar changes.

Is it bad that redwoods are doing very well in the UK?

Re: Fields where Native Americans farmed a thousand years ago discovered in Michigan

#57

Post by happosai »

pfdietz wrote: post #56
andy99 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invasive_earthworms_of_North... Also learning about this today. Apparently they're bad for ecosystems that had evolved with slowly decaying organic matter (because they eat it all quickly). In particular forests. At least in my education they have always been framed as a vital component of the ecosystem and a sign of healthy soil. It's interesting to learn that's not true.

To some extent it's a matter of definition, and whether being caused by humanity means it's bad. After all, the native earthworms would eventually have migrated north and caused similar changes. Is it bad that redwoods are doing very well in the UK?

The problem isn't "because it was caused by humans" per se. Invasive species because of the speed they migrate. Adapting genetically changing environment is the core of life in our planet, but it takes thousands of generations. Humans spread invasive species much faster than the local fauna can adapt.

Re: Fields where Native Americans farmed a thousand years ago discovered in Michigan

#58

Post by MangoToupe »

sfjailbird wrote: post #35
politelemon wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't have imagined broken pottery could serve as compost, how is that made possible? It's clay but it retains some properties even after baking?

You're all overthinking it. They dumped their kitchen waste in the fields, and it happened to contain broken pottery too. It's the same for other archeological sites all over, many are waste dumps that contain interesting objects.

How would you characterize this distinction? It sounds like you're simply describing the same behavior.

Re: Fields where Native Americans farmed a thousand years ago discovered in Michigan

#60

Post by ashoeafoot »

acdha wrote: post #36
mapotofu wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That natives did not colonize Europe or China does not mean they were not highly skilled with plants. What kind of argument are you making?

I think they were just engaging in time-honored speculation about how different history could’ve been had a few historical accidents changed. For example, the Mayan civilization collapsed about 500 years before the Spanish showed up due to the worst drought in something like 7k years, so people have speculated about what Mesoamerica might have looked like when contact was made of those millions of people hadn’t died.…

They also had a civilization knowledge base within them , which they could have mined. But there wasn't even a united south-north native empire.
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