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Why I now, unfortunately, hate Hacker News..

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Re: Why I now, unfortunately, hate Hacker News..

#51

Post by TravisLS »

I've also noticed this negative trend and was thinking of writing about it. I was going to try and quantify it, but never got around to it. I don't post on HN very frequently, but I've read it several times a day for the last 4+ years. Lately it does seem like the tops of comment threads are almost always negative dismissals of the post, rather than additions or constructive contributions. It's made the comments threads much less interesting to read.

Especially in the case of Show HN posts, like you mention, it seems like people put themselves out there and most of the comments shoot them down, often without really exploring or trying to understand what they've spent their time on. Negative feedback is often quite helpful, but knee-jerk negative feedback almost never is.

Obviously it's a tough game, and you've got to have thick skin, but it did used to seem like this was a place to go to learn to succeed, and lately it kind of seems like a place to go to learn that everything sucks.

As for what to do about it, I'm not sure. I'll just keep reading it every day until a new, smaller, more constructive community pops up. I am (and I suspect many others on this site are as well), basically just an education junkie, and as the community becomes less educational, it becomes less attractive than alternatives.

Re: Why I now, unfortunately, hate Hacker News..

#52

Post by mindcrime »

victork2 wrote: post #41

Hi Steve, I don't know if you are going to read this, but I'm going to write it for the rest of the audience too. I think the trend of dismissing critics and commenting along the lines of "sour grapes" or "haters" very disturbing. Yes I go against your commentary. The great thing about internet and communities based on pseudonyms is that you get the first reaction that people have. Very few will take a few minutes to…

Fads/ Jealousy: A lot of people here want to be rich and famous thus it creates tension. It allows me to come back to your point: these people are likely going to dismiss your ideas based on jealousy

Maybe I've just missed it, but I haven't seen a lot of responses here that seem to be obviously motivated by jealousy. I get the feeling that, despite how many of us there are, most of us are working on different things. I mean, there are so many ideas, and potential ideas, I don't feel like I've seen a lot of overlap.

And when I have seen it, I feel like a lot of the comments have been of the "Hey, this is similar to what we're doing, shoot me a message offline and let's talk" variety.

Re: Why I now, unfortunately, hate Hacker News..

#53

Post by luser001 »

sw007 wrote: post #34
bhousel wrote: post #3

What projects are you working on now? If you're still stuck with a long commute and you are looking for something to build, you could try your hand at a Hacker News replacement. There are certainly enough people here jaded by the toxicity that would make the jump someplace new. My only piece of advice, if you decide do this, don't post it as a "Show HN". Reach out to smart people privately to beta test it.

So I shut down (albeit people can still sign in) a site called favilous which was a bookmarking site. And recently I read a book called Join Me by Danny Wallace and thought it would be cool to see if that translated to the web so I created www.11kclub.com but got castigated by HN for being unoriginal, for being a rubbish idea and for the manner in which it was posted. I accept people will be negative and won't like e…

Hmm, I just pasted the 11kclub URL into my browser. The front page has no info on what this is about, but you still go ahead and ask for some personal info.

I looked at the favilous front page. It looks pretty decent. Good luck.

Re: Why I now, unfortunately, hate Hacker News..

#55

Post by jakejake »

Hey, I can't say that I feel your pain. I can't seem to get my projects on the front page even though some negative feedback would be welcomed and even helpful.

I think done amount of negativity is something that just happens on all tech forums. Programmers are an opinionated lot.

Re: Why I now, unfortunately, hate Hacker News..

#56

Post by lifeisstillgood »

victork2 wrote: post #41

Hi Steve, I don't know if you are going to read this, but I'm going to write it for the rest of the audience too. I think the trend of dismissing critics and commenting along the lines of "sour grapes" or "haters" very disturbing. Yes I go against your commentary. The great thing about internet and communities based on pseudonyms is that you get the first reaction that people have. Very few will take a few minutes to…

>> * Well thought comments are often ignored and not read ( not up/downvoted, just ignored )

I would say this is the biggest issue for me - I am just not into that habit.

I would suggest putting a header into the orabe bar:

"Please generously upvote if you think something is intelligent, well written or inciteful or otherwise postiviely contributes to the conversation"

That said, here is a +1

Re: Why I now, unfortunately, hate Hacker News..

#57

Post by mindcrime »

jack-r-abbit wrote: post #49
untog wrote: post #4

Sigh. Personally, I don't have a problem with people being negative. 99% of startups fail, and I think it's worthwhile reminding people of that every now and then. Hacker News shouldn't live in some magical land where everyone is going to make the next billion dollar company. If you truly, genuinely, believe in your idea then you can take the negativity in your stride. There will be plenty of constructive feedback bu…

> And maybe it is a bad idea. ^This. Sometimes people feel very passionate about something and they get tunnel vision. They invest hours, weeks, years on something and to them it is going to be the next big thing that will get the girl, kill the baddies... and save the entire planet[1]. But guess what? Sometimes... sometimes ... it really is just shit. Sorry to tell you this but your idea sucks... or the execution su…

If all you want to hear is how awesome it is, then go show it to your mum. I'm sure she'll tell you how special you are and that you can do no wrong.

Sounds like a strawman to me. Who here has said anything about wanting nothing but positivity, or to be told how awesome they are? Even negativity can be combined with encouragement and support. And it doesn't really cost anymore to do that.

A. "Your idea is pretty bad. You suck. Kill yourself."

B. "Your idea is pretty bad; have you considered XXX? At any rate, best of luck to you!"

OK, to be fair, (B) cost a few more characters of typing for the pedants in the audience. But there's no significant extra cost involved with throwing a little encouragement and support someone's way.

Re: Why I now, unfortunately, hate Hacker News..

#58

Post by sw007 »

luser001 wrote: post #53
sw007 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So I shut down (albeit people can still sign in) a site called favilous which was a bookmarking site. And recently I read a book called Join Me by Danny Wallace and thought it would be cool to see if that translated to the web so I created www.11kclub.com but got castigated by HN for being unoriginal, for being a rubbish idea and for the manner in which it was posted. I accept people will be negative and won't like e…

Hmm, I just pasted the 11kclub URL into my browser. The front page has no info on what this is about, but you still go ahead and ask for some personal info. I looked at the favilous front page. It looks pretty decent. Good luck.

11k is part of a social experiment to see if people will sign up to something they know nothing about just because it is exclusive. And thanks, appreciate it.

Re: Why I now, unfortunately, hate Hacker News..

#59

Post by waterside81 »

Whenever I read posts like this I wonder if I happen to be really lucky at reading comments to posts that are never negative in nature. I've never (or so seldom they don't stick out) seen any of these issues on HN - my experience is almost universally positive. I think HN is just fine.

Re: Why I now, unfortunately, hate Hacker News..

#60

Post by mindcrime »

tomku wrote: post #38

I can't speak for other users, but I'd rather see more project launches than any of the following types of submissions: - Rumors about what Apple will do next week, and the ensuing flamewars between Apple fans and Android fans - TorrentFreak articles of any kind - Overbearing hype about the latest fad (App.net at the moment) - Mindless hatred towards the latest villain (Twitter at the moment) - Anything political tha…

I can't speak for other users, but I'd rather see more project launches than any of the following types of submissions:

Agreed. "Show HN" posts are probably the most important part of HN to me. I don't always comment, but I always enjoy seeing them, and I love it when you see somebody post something that is incredibly useful to the OP. It warms the heart to see one of those conversations that goes:

somerandomuser "I like this, but FOO seems kinda wonky. We did something similar once, and found that BAR increased our conversion rate by 12.9%"

submitter "Holy shit, that's a great idea. I never thought of that, but I'm going to implement that tonight! Thanks for sharing."

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