Live data from Hacker News

Not a three-year-old chimney sweep (2022)

fakehistoryhunter.net

51–60 of 74 posts

Re: Not a three-year-old chimney sweep (2022)

#51

> But the pavement looked familiar to me, I’m specialised in Europe during the 1920s-40s and have worked on a project about daily life in Berlin in the 1920s and I’ve seen that pavement in other old footage and in countless photos. I visited Jerusalem yesterday, and was struck by the fact that there are places in the world where people have been continuously walking for millennia, putting their feet on the same stone…

Barcelona has a distinctive paving style; it has become a symbol of the city.

If you live here and see it everyday, you spot it instantly when watching TV show or movie that was made here.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panot

Re: Not a three-year-old chimney sweep (2022)

#52
post #22
post #9

There should be a name for the phenomenon where people upset about some injustice pick the least plausible example to use as the cause celebre of the injustice. For a more modern take I can't understand why Daniel Shaver is not the face of police murder in the US. The video is on YouTube, you can find the unedited version with a Google search. There is no benefit of the doubt to give. It was straight up murder done o…

It's unfortunate that the shooter was not convicted, but the mere fact that there was an investigation and a trial differentiates it from a lot of police violence causes célèbres.

what, why?

Re: Not a three-year-old chimney sweep (2022)

#53
post #25
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Part of why people are upsetis because they think this is a much more recent example of the thing they dislike than expected. It's disingenuous to pretend it's only the practice not the context which influences people.

Sure, context matters. You could claim "there were no 3 year olds ACTUALLY working as chimney sweeps anywhere in the world in 1930", if you wanted to make this point. But, I suspect it's not so clear if that's even true, just as the author can only suspect this is a reenactment in this photo.

I think you’ll find they the article makes some very good arguments for why this is indeed a reenactment.

I think the best argument is that three year olds would make extremely ineffective chimney sweeps. I don’t know if you’ve met any recently? They would require more effort in supervision than they save by way of their labor. Much more.

Re: Not a three-year-old chimney sweep (2022)

#54
post #43
post #9

There should be a name for the phenomenon where people upset about some injustice pick the least plausible example to use as the cause celebre of the injustice. For a more modern take I can't understand why Daniel Shaver is not the face of police murder in the US. The video is on YouTube, you can find the unedited version with a Google search. There is no benefit of the doubt to give. It was straight up murder done o…

> There should be a name for the phenomenon where people upset about some injustice pick the least plausible example to use as the cause celebre of the injustice. Perhaps 'The Toxoplasma of Rage'? See https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/12/17/the-toxoplasma-of-rage... Or you might like https://slatestarcodex.com/2017/04/12/clarification-to-sacre...

Thanks for reminding me of CGP Grey's "This Video Will Make You Angry": https://youtu.be/rE3j_RHkqJc

Now I feel I should rewatch this video annually as a reminder to myself, or maybe monthly.

Re: Not a three-year-old chimney sweep (2022)

#55
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> no one remembers it. That doesn't resonate with my experience. People know about the murder, but aren't sure what to do. The murderer, who clearly had mental health issues (eg, having "you're fucked" on the dust cover of his personal AR-15, which he used to commit the act), was acquitted (in a trial of strange circumstances). It's baffling that none of his colleagues - who saw the message on his weapon - ever pulle…

I am not remotely aware of this case. How does those words, or any words, on a gun case/cover relate to mental health issues? This isn't a manifesto; it is more like "guard dog? Beware of owner!" decal, or a Calvin pissing on a coexist sticker. Or truck nuts. These might be distasteful to some but is unrelated to mental health. I'd be more worried about my former neighbor who had an unhealthy love of maglite flashlig…

The "you're fucked" was written on the inside of the ejection port dust cover so that it would become visible after the weapon was fired. The implication is that he was eager to shoot someone.

Re: Not a three-year-old chimney sweep (2022)

#56
post #11
post #9

There should be a name for the phenomenon where people upset about some injustice pick the least plausible example to use as the cause celebre of the injustice. For a more modern take I can't understand why Daniel Shaver is not the face of police murder in the US. The video is on YouTube, you can find the unedited version with a Google search. There is no benefit of the doubt to give. It was straight up murder done o…

> no one remembers it. That doesn't resonate with my experience. People know about the murder, but aren't sure what to do. The murderer, who clearly had mental health issues (eg, having "you're fucked" on the dust cover of his personal AR-15, which he used to commit the act), was acquitted (in a trial of strange circumstances). It's baffling that none of his colleagues - who saw the message on his weapon - ever pulle…

His colleagues likely didn't find the dust cover noteworthy. Within contemporary American gun culture, it would seem like a minor bit of braggadocio akin to a "Protected by Smith & Wesson" sticker or a "Warning: We Don't Dial 911" placard; tacky and unprofessional, but not something to take seriously. There's a whole little industry around AR-15 customization, offering thousands of options for engraved dust covers with all kinds of symbols and messages:

https://midstatefirearms.com/product/engraved-dust-cover-eje...

https://mcsgearup.com/ar-15-ejection-port-dust-cover-engravi...

https://www.wingtactical.com/firearm-parts/ar-15/upper-recei...

https://cordedarms.com/ExoticCovers1

Re: Not a three-year-old chimney sweep (2022)

#57
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> no one remembers it. That doesn't resonate with my experience. People know about the murder, but aren't sure what to do. The murderer, who clearly had mental health issues (eg, having "you're fucked" on the dust cover of his personal AR-15, which he used to commit the act), was acquitted (in a trial of strange circumstances). It's baffling that none of his colleagues - who saw the message on his weapon - ever pulle…

I am not remotely aware of this case. How does those words, or any words, on a gun case/cover relate to mental health issues? This isn't a manifesto; it is more like "guard dog? Beware of owner!" decal, or a Calvin pissing on a coexist sticker. Or truck nuts. These might be distasteful to some but is unrelated to mental health. I'd be more worried about my former neighbor who had an unhealthy love of maglite flashlig…

As someone who avoids making threats in public, those stickers and whatnot do leave me concerned about the person's mental health.

Re: Not a three-year-old chimney sweep (2022)

#58
post #12

So it was a common practice a century before the photo was taken. How is it surprising that people get upset? The photo is a record of a depiction of a practice that existed. It’s the practice that people don’t like, not the depiction.

It wasn't common practice for 3-year-olds to do it. The article says usually 6 was the youngest.

Re: Not a three-year-old chimney sweep (2022)

#59
post #50
post #12

So it was a common practice a century before the photo was taken. How is it surprising that people get upset? The photo is a record of a depiction of a practice that existed. It’s the practice that people don’t like, not the depiction.

Actually, I take back what I said. The article doesn't even conclusively demonstrate that this is a reenactment.

Well a law was passed 30 years earlier making it illegal.

Re: Not a three-year-old chimney sweep (2022)

#60
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you read the article? It was a real world practice, but long gone already at that time (in the mentioned parts of Europe at least).

I'll play's devil's advocate - is there really a difference? People were angry (rightfully so) at children chimney sweeps and they definitely existed, were abused and did die/have horrible problems/etc. So the outrage is justified. Now, the specific picture isn't true/authentic, but the contents of the picture definitely existed did. So is it wrong?

What's the point of getting angry about something that happened so long ago that the angry people's grandparents weren't born yet?
Post reply on HN