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ACARS Drama

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Re: ACARS Drama

#51

Post by sooperserieous »

q3k wrote: post #47
marcellus23 wrote: post #18

Interesting that the keyboard for these[0] is not a QWERTY keyboard but instead has the buttons arranged alphabetically. That must be a pain in the ass to type in. Is that because the tech is 50 years old from before QWERTY was the standard? Do newer planes have QWERTY? 0: https://acarsdrama.com/fmc.webp Unrelated, this one is cute: https://infosec.exchange/@acarsdrama/114194436695883209

> That must be a pain in the ass to type in. You get used to it, same as you got used to a QWERTY keyboard. (note: this based on my experience often interacting with another device with an alphabetic keyboard, not an FMC)

You do get used to it, but also the workflow is not entering words as much as it is things like waypoint codes, and a lot of numeric bits, which is why the number pad has its familiar layout.

Re: ACARS Drama

#52

Post by esoterae »

buildsjets wrote: post #45
Suppafly wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Is that because the tech is 50 years old from before QWERTY was the standard? QWERTY predates electronic devices.

QWERTY was invented to make input slower on mechanical devices and prevent the mechanical equivalent of a buffer overflow.

I always thought of it as more of a race condition.

Re: ACARS Drama

#53

Post by joezydeco »

marcellus23 wrote: post #32
joezydeco wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if you did QWERTY, how would you arrange it in a 5x6 matrix?

I was imagining the panel could be designed such that you wouldn't need to fit it in a 5x6 matrix.

Avionics is the area that is the least tolerant of radical redesigns in human interfaces. This FMC form factor has been around a long time. There are newer ACARS/FMC systems that have an actual QWERTY keyboard.

https://www.aviationtoday.com/2016/04/27/spectralux-launches...

Remember, also, that not all countries use QWERTY. France, one of the homes of Airbus, uses AZERTY. What should they do about their keyboards?

Re: ACARS Drama

#54

Post by esoterae »

marcellus23 wrote: post #44
Suppafly wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Is that because the tech is 50 years old from before QWERTY was the standard? QWERTY predates electronic devices.

True. Makes the decision even more baffling.

Keyboards in aircraft instrumentation certainly do NOT predate electronic devices. Given that one-handed operation for instrumentation is almost always the primary mode of interaction, and instrument panels are really just face-plates on quite deep electronic device containers, the idea of a widescreen panel hole profile just to fit the input keys in a different format/aspect ratio does not make sense.

Some of the most interesting aviation research in the past few decades have been around human factors like psychology, perception, and cognition. If there was some substantial effect to having the buttons be arranged in a different pattern, I do legitimately hope it would have been found by now.

Do keep in mind these devices are cost-prohibitive in the extreme to design, build, and certify. The idea of having separate, parallel processes in order to have a different button layout between regional devices creates a thousand headaches of its own, both before and after production. The issue goes even further, in that just the FAA alone requires simulators of these aircraft to have replicated button look and feel criteria that would make your head spin. Is there even going to be a question as to if you're going to have to have two simulators? Will type-ratings be transferrable? Will there be separate differences training and/or currency requirements between the two distinct input methods?

Some or even most of those answers might turn out favorably for manufacturers or operators or pilots. But just having to ask them drives costs up considerably.

Re: ACARS Drama

#55

Post by stronglikedan »

marcellus23 wrote: post #18

Interesting that the keyboard for these[0] is not a QWERTY keyboard but instead has the buttons arranged alphabetically. That must be a pain in the ass to type in. Is that because the tech is 50 years old from before QWERTY was the standard? Do newer planes have QWERTY? 0: https://acarsdrama.com/fmc.webp Unrelated, this one is cute: https://infosec.exchange/@acarsdrama/114194436695883209

> That must be a pain in the ass to type in.

Only until you're used to it. Then it's just as natural as switching between a keypad with a 1 in the top left versus one with a 7 in the top left. Your brain just takes the wheel.

Re: ACARS Drama

#56

Post by MBCook »

Most of the messages I get.

By why show the ones with only an ETA and FOB? Is FOB code for something interesting?

Re: ACARS Drama

#58

Post by lxgr »

cccbbbaaa wrote: post #46
marcellus23 wrote: post #18

Interesting that the keyboard for these[0] is not a QWERTY keyboard but instead has the buttons arranged alphabetically. That must be a pain in the ass to type in. Is that because the tech is 50 years old from before QWERTY was the standard? Do newer planes have QWERTY? 0: https://acarsdrama.com/fmc.webp Unrelated, this one is cute: https://infosec.exchange/@acarsdrama/114194436695883209

I believe the A350 has it in qwerty.

The A380 even has a stowable full-size keyboard, as far as I know! Not sure if it can input data into this particular system, though.

Re: ACARS Drama

#60

Post by lxgr »

outworlder wrote: post #38
wylie39 wrote: post #27

What's the legality of this? I was thinking of doing something similar but with POCSAG but from what I can tell it would be illegal because of ECPA(Electronic Communications Privacy Act)

It's broadcast in the clear, unencrypted. Just like all non-military aircraft comms.

> It's broadcast in the clear, unencrypted.

But so were analog mobile phones and pagers, and in some countries, even receiving unencrypted voice ATC radio isn't legal.

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