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Everything about Google Translate crashing React (and other web apps)

martijnhols.nl

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Re: Everything about Google Translate crashing React (and other web apps)

#51

Post by JimDabell »

MartijnHols wrote: post #17
nottorp wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Both Google and React are guilty here if i read the article right. Google replaces an element with a different element (Text with Font containing Text?), and React's virtual DOM keeps the old, deleted elements alive because the virtual DOM still references them. React "applications" would crash when Google Translate changes their stuff from under them if they didn't accidentally keep the old elements alive. Which wou…

They both do reasonable things, so I wouldn't really blame either. Google Translate was there first and is a big accessibility advantage for the web. At the same time, Google Translate is the user-specific browser extension that is executed last, on top of existing apps. It affects not just React[1], so even if React were to implement a fix, Google Translate would continue to interfere with other webapps. I think any…

I don’t see why Google Translate wrapping all text in elements is reasonable. Why is an extra element required, and why is it of all things? Translate is swapping text for text, so this shouldn’t be necessary. It also breaks a lot more than just JavaScript frameworks. Things like the child combinator in CSS selectors will break too.

Re: Everything about Google Translate crashing React (and other web apps)

#52

Post by phantomathkg »

Freak_NL wrote: post #32
rjst01 wrote: post #8

> When I first ran into this issue back in 2017, I posted in the React issue tracker that I had ”fixed” my app by blocking translation entirely. Please do not do this! In almost every instance I've encountered severe Translate-related broken-ness, it's still worked well enough to get me a snapshot of the current page translated. Fighting through this is still less cumbersome than the alternatives. > The only alternat…

> I will add, please make sure that language is an independent setting, and not derived from locale! Websites already have exactly what they need to provide you with the language you want via the Accept-Language header your browser sends. In your browser's settings you can configure a list of languages (country-specific if desired) which get send with every request. E.g.,: en-GB en nl (Prefer British English, fall ba…

This does not help in many many situations.

I am a Hongkonger, natively speaks Cantonese, fluent in English and learning Japanese.

If I go to Google I want English UI and prioritise traditional Chinese result then English then simplified Chinese.

On the other hand if I go to a Japanese website, I don’t want them to translate for me, just display the original Japanese will be fine. Unless I toggle.

These kind of complex setup can never be achieved if we don’t have a per site locale policy. And seriously. A toggle per site is easier than navigate three level deep into browser setting page.

Re: Everything about Google Translate crashing React (and other web apps)

#53

Post by archerx »

Freak_NL wrote: post #32
rjst01 wrote: post #8

> When I first ran into this issue back in 2017, I posted in the React issue tracker that I had ”fixed” my app by blocking translation entirely. Please do not do this! In almost every instance I've encountered severe Translate-related broken-ness, it's still worked well enough to get me a snapshot of the current page translated. Fighting through this is still less cumbersome than the alternatives. > The only alternat…

> I will add, please make sure that language is an independent setting, and not derived from locale! Websites already have exactly what they need to provide you with the language you want via the Accept-Language header your browser sends. In your browser's settings you can configure a list of languages (country-specific if desired) which get send with every request. E.g.,: en-GB en nl (Prefer British English, fall ba…

Almost no website uses this, even big ones like Google who insist on showing me pages in German rather than English or French.

Re: Everything about Google Translate crashing React (and other web apps)

#55

Post by PetitPrince »

archerx wrote: post #53
Freak_NL wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I will add, please make sure that language is an independent setting, and not derived from locale! Websites already have exactly what they need to provide you with the language you want via the Accept-Language header your browser sends. In your browser's settings you can configure a list of languages (country-specific if desired) which get send with every request. E.g.,: en-GB en nl (Prefer British English, fall ba…

Almost no website uses this, even big ones like Google who insist on showing me pages in German rather than English or French.

On the other hand, sometime the ads that are shown are in German. Easier to mentally filter out.

Re: Everything about Google Translate crashing React (and other web apps)

#56

Post by rjst01 »

LtWorf wrote: post #39
Freak_NL wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I will add, please make sure that language is an independent setting, and not derived from locale! Websites already have exactly what they need to provide you with the language you want via the Accept-Language header your browser sends. In your browser's settings you can configure a list of languages (country-specific if desired) which get send with every request. E.g.,: en-GB en nl (Prefer British English, fall ba…

> This should be the primary way to decide upon a language Google developers are very intelligent, but not intelligent enough to understand this.

They probably understand it just fine. Someone higher-up has just over-ruled them. There may even be a good reason for it, but because of the way companies work, we will probably never find out what it is.

Re: Everything about Google Translate crashing React (and other web apps)

#57

Post by rjst01 »

SebastianKra wrote: post #38
rjst01 wrote: post #8

> When I first ran into this issue back in 2017, I posted in the React issue tracker that I had ”fixed” my app by blocking translation entirely. Please do not do this! In almost every instance I've encountered severe Translate-related broken-ness, it's still worked well enough to get me a snapshot of the current page translated. Fighting through this is still less cumbersome than the alternatives. > The only alternat…

I'd have no issue leaving translation enabled, if the translator was an optional feature that the user must opt-in to, and that's clearly communicated as something not controlled by the developer. But I've received reports from Edge-users that didn't even know translation was enabled.

Yeah, I agree that's problematic. And I would have no objection to implementing a UI feature that displayed a warning banner of some kind if it detected that the page had been translated.

Re: Everything about Google Translate crashing React (and other web apps)

#58

Post by lobsterthief »

nottorp wrote: post #3

So the fundamental problem is the DOM is too inefficient to do applications on it. No surprise there, considering the original design of HTML was for presenting information, not for interactive applications.

> No surprise there, considering the original design of HTML was for presenting information, not for interactive applications.

Even in this we’re just HTML displaying information, there’s effectively this second application (Google Translate) changing the structure of the original application’s XML, which would still break display (or XPATHs) in a “normal HTML presenting information” scenario.

Re: Everything about Google Translate crashing React (and other web apps)

#60

Post by masswerk »

Freak_NL wrote: post #32
rjst01 wrote: post #8

> When I first ran into this issue back in 2017, I posted in the React issue tracker that I had ”fixed” my app by blocking translation entirely. Please do not do this! In almost every instance I've encountered severe Translate-related broken-ness, it's still worked well enough to get me a snapshot of the current page translated. Fighting through this is still less cumbersome than the alternatives. > The only alternat…

> I will add, please make sure that language is an independent setting, and not derived from locale! Websites already have exactly what they need to provide you with the language you want via the Accept-Language header your browser sends. In your browser's settings you can configure a list of languages (country-specific if desired) which get send with every request. E.g.,: en-GB en nl (Prefer British English, fall ba…

This is not true. E.g., Safari is tied to the OS settings, Firefox has some dependencies regarding the locale of the first install, etc…

Moreover, probably most people speak or can read more than a single language. There may be reasons for accessing a site in a particular language other than the standard locale.

Please empower users to make their own choice! Do not assume to know better.

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