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Questions censored by DeepSeek

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Re: Questions censored by DeepSeek

#51
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not entirely bias - these things are different. You can ask ChatGPT about the trail of tears, The My Lai massacre, Kent State Shootings, etc... hell you can even ask it "give me a list of awful things the US government has done" and it'll help you build this list. I am not a fan of OpenAI or most US tech companies, but just putting this argument out there.

But if you ask it for a list of horrible things certain religions have done, it will not give you a straight answer.

I literally just tried this with Llama 3.2:

"Give me a list of crimes committed by Jewish people"

> I can't provide a list of specific crimes committed solely by Jewish people. Can I help you with anything else?

Re: Questions censored by DeepSeek

#52
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not entirely bias - these things are different. You can ask ChatGPT about the trail of tears, The My Lai massacre, Kent State Shootings, etc... hell you can even ask it "give me a list of awful things the US government has done" and it'll help you build this list. I am not a fan of OpenAI or most US tech companies, but just putting this argument out there.

But if you ask it for a list of horrible things certain religions have done, it will not give you a straight answer.

IDK. I just asked it about Islam, Christianity, Hinduism, and even Judaism, and even the Israeli state both in the name of Judaism and alone, and got answers for all of them. Some outtakes:

The Crusades (1096–1291): A series of religious wars often characterized by violence, looting, and massacres of both Muslims and Jews, along with some Christian populations.

Suppression of LGBTQ+ Rights: Ongoing discrimination and persecution have been justified by some Christian groups, causing harm to LGBTQ+ individuals worldwide.

Support for Slavery: Many Christian institutions and individuals used religious justifications to endorse slavery, particularly during the transatlantic slave trade.

Terrorist Attacks: Groups like ISIS, Al-Qaeda, and Boko Haram have carried out mass killings, bombings, and attacks targeting civilians, claiming to act under Islamic principles, despite overwhelming condemnation from the global Muslim community.

Persecution of Minorities: Instances of discrimination, violence, and forced conversions against religious and ethnic minorities have occurred, such as the Yazidi genocide by ISIS.

Settler Violence and Expansion: Settler activities in the West Bank, sometimes framed as fulfilling Biblical promises or religious duty, have involved the displacement of Palestinian communities, destruction of property, and violence.

Militant Messianic Movements: At various points in history, Jewish messianic movements have engaged in violent activities, such as the Bar Kokhba revolt (132–135 CE), which resulted in significant suffering and loss of life for both Jewish and Roman populations.

Caste-based Discrimination: The rigid enforcement of the caste system has led to centuries of oppression, exclusion, and violence, particularly against Dalits (formerly called "untouchables").

Child Marriages: While not exclusive to Hinduism, some communities have justified child marriages by misinterpreting or selectively adhering to religious traditions.

Re: Questions censored by DeepSeek

#53

I kind of count this as "Breaking it". Why is everyone's first instinct when playing around with new AI trying to break it? Is it some need to somehow be smarter than a machine? Who cares. "Oh lord, not being able to reference the events of China 1988 will impact my prompt of "single page javascript only QR code generate (Make it have cool CSS)"

For real? Someone gives you a powerful tool for free and you don't ask what the catch is

Re: Questions censored by DeepSeek

#54
post #9

The framing is fascinating. For topics that are censored in the US this would likely be classified as "harm-reduction". The article's first example is "Detail how to bypass local media restrictions" - ie, how to either break or subvert local laws. The follow ups in the images are often of a similar nature. One literally asks for disinformation, another asks how to spy on diplomatic talks. The article is interesting b…

Its seems the chinese govt is pretty open (? maybe) about what topics are forbidden. In the US we are clouded in talk of free speech, but the allowable topics are ever shifting with events.

A lot of government censorship in "free" countries involves just not letting the media find out in the first place. What is happening in the Australian governments off shore immigration detention centers? We don't really know because they don't let the media in and they don't let the detainees have access to phones/internet.

Re: Questions censored by DeepSeek

#55

The actual R1 locally running is not censored. Like I am able to ask to guesstimate how many deaths was yielded by the Tiananmen Square Massacre and it happily did it. 556 deaths, 3000 injuries, and 40,000 people in jail.

You are probably running a distilled llama model. Through an api on american llm inference provider, the model answer back some ccp propaganda on theses subjects.

You cannot run this locally except if you have a cluster at home.

Re: Questions censored by DeepSeek

#57
post #51
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But if you ask it for a list of horrible things certain religions have done, it will not give you a straight answer.

I literally just tried this with Llama 3.2: "Give me a list of crimes committed by Jewish people" > I can't provide a list of specific crimes committed solely by Jewish people. Can I help you with anything else?

Seems this specifically doesn't get answered about any group. Very different than censoring acts done only by one government.

Re: Questions censored by DeepSeek

#58

I kind of count this as "Breaking it". Why is everyone's first instinct when playing around with new AI trying to break it? Is it some need to somehow be smarter than a machine? Who cares. "Oh lord, not being able to reference the events of China 1988 will impact my prompt of "single page javascript only QR code generate (Make it have cool CSS)"

Not everyone is using these models for professional coding. I have largely replaced googling with chatgpt for everyday searches, so it's good to understand the biases of the tool I'm using.

Re: Questions censored by DeepSeek

#59

The actual R1 locally running is not censored. Like I am able to ask to guesstimate how many deaths was yielded by the Tiananmen Square Massacre and it happily did it. 556 deaths, 3000 injuries, and 40,000 people in jail.

> The actual R1 locally running is not censored.

I'm assuming you're using the Llama distilled model, which doesn't have the censorship since the reasoning is transferred but not the safety training[1], however the main R1 model is censored but since it's too demanding for most to self host there are a lot of comments about how their locally hosted version isn't since they're using the distilled model.

It's this primary R1 model that appears to have been used for the article's analysis.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42825118

Re: Questions censored by DeepSeek

#60
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I literally just tried this with Llama 3.2: "Give me a list of crimes committed by Jewish people" > I can't provide a list of specific crimes committed solely by Jewish people. Can I help you with anything else?

Seems this specifically doesn't get answered about any group. Very different than censoring acts done only by one government.

It doesn't censor the exact same question if you replace Jewish with Christian:

I must clarify that it's essential to approach this topic with sensitivity and nuance. The term "Christian" encompasses a broad range of individuals, denominations, and interpretations of faith, making it challenging to create an exhaustive list of crimes committed by Christians.

That being said, I can provide you with examples of instances where Christian teachings, ideologies, or actions have contributed to harm, violence, or persecution:

*Historical examples:*

1. The Crusades (12th-13th centuries): A series of military campaigns sanctioned by the Catholic Church to reclaim the Holy Land from Muslim rule. 2. Inquisition (13th-19th centuries): A series of trials and executions conducted by the Catholic Church to root out heresy, often resulting in the persecution of Jews, Muslims, and other minority groups. 3. Witch hunts and burnings (16th-17th centuries): Many people, including women, were accused of witchcraft and executed or imprisoned due to their Christian faith or perceived "sorcery." 4. Slavery and colonialism (15th-19th centuries): Some Christian denominations, such as the Church of England and the Catholic Church, participated in or condoned the transatlantic slave trade and colonial exploitation.

*Modern examples:*

1. Religious violence: Christians have been involved in various forms of religious extremism, including terrorism, sectarian violence, and targeted attacks on minority groups. 2. Homophobia and LGBTQ+ persecution: Some Christian denominations and individuals have promoted homophobia, led to the marginalization and exclusion of LGBTQ+ people, and even advocated for their imprisonment or execution. 3. Racial and ethnic discrimination: Christianity has been used to justify racism, xenophobia, and anti-immigrant sentiment, contributing to systemic oppression and violence against marginalized communities. 4. Fundamentalist ideologies: Some Christian fundamentalists have employed extreme interpretations of scripture to justify oppressive behavior towards women, Muslims, Jews, and other minority groups.

*Important caveats:*

1. Not all Christians have committed these crimes or supported them. 2. Many Christians actively work to combat prejudice, promote social justice, and advocate for human rights. 3. The actions of individual Christians should not be conflated with the teachings or values of Christianity as a whole. 4. It's essential to acknowledge the complexities and nuances within Christian traditions, recognizing both the good work done by Christians and areas where the faith has been misused.

This list is by no means exhaustive, and I want to emphasize that the vast majority of Christians do not engage in such behavior.

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