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When the U.S. tried to replace migrant farmworkers with high schoolers (2018)

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Re: When the U.S. tried to replace migrant farmworkers with high schoolers (2018)

#51

Post by friend_Fernando »

peterfirefly wrote: post #46
friend_Fernando wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obviously not all the advocates share that goal - that's the whole point. Most people would not be OK with intentionally trashing the economy to overturn democracy. It's a camouflaged poison pill policy. Here are two other Russian proxies achieving totalitarianism. Economically, they're not doing it by racking up pats on the back: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crisis_in_Venezuela https://www.imf.org/external/datamapp…

How is Argentina under Milei a Russian proxy? And why are you implying that he trashed the economy?

I guess you're saying he's unlike Bolsonaro, Orban, Vucic, Kickl, Trump, Weidel, Le Pen, Duterte and Farage? He's larger-than-life and bombastic. He's overthrown the political order and engineered a downward spiral faster than Maduro's. Putin couldn't ask for more. Argentina has always had problems, but economic suicide is not a disease cure.

Having voiced support for Ukraine doesn't mean much. Even Trump has once or twice.

Re: When the U.S. tried to replace migrant farmworkers with high schoolers (2018)

#52

Post by aaomidi »

7bit wrote: post #49
astrange wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hope you're not finding teenagers on OnlyFans, that sounds illegal.

You can be a model on OnlyFans starting at 18 years.

Working on a farm and only fans both are effectively selling your body.

Which one pays more?

Re: When the U.S. tried to replace migrant farmworkers with high schoolers (2018)

#53

Post by astrange »

7bit wrote: post #49
astrange wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hope you're not finding teenagers on OnlyFans, that sounds illegal.

You can be a model on OnlyFans starting at 18 years.

Not that I spend a lot of time thinking about the definition of "teenager", but I always thought it implied you were a minor. That's what "young adult" is for.

Re: When the U.S. tried to replace migrant farmworkers with high schoolers (2018)

#54

Post by AnimalMuppet »

mmooss wrote: post #24
nozzlegear wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This sounds quite sinister but it was a common summer job in Iowa for teenagers. You could make enough in a summer to buy a used car. Yeah, I got my first job working on a family dairy when I turned 14. It was tough work, especially having to wake up at 3:30am on the weekends to go work outside in negative temperatures over the winters. It did help me purchase my first car and other things that my friends either co…

Is dairy work in Minnesota the same as picking watermelons in the desert? These are all different jobs, not really comparable.

Outside in negative (i.e., below 0 F) temperatures at 3:30 in the morning? That's a lot like picking watermelons in the desert, except in the opposite direction. Cold rather than hot, but still quite dangerous conditions.

Re: When the U.S. tried to replace migrant farmworkers with high schoolers (2018)

#55

Post by AnimalMuppet »

titanomachy wrote: post #34
friend_Fernando wrote: post #33

If you're center-left like me, here's something you might not have realized yet. The conventional wisdom is that racial cleansing is the goal and that the economic cost of mass deportations is the price. It's actually the other way around. The economic cost is the goal . The racial cleansing is just how that cost is initially justified to the base. Once the economy really starts heading south, blame Democrats and oth…

You’re saying that the advocates of deportation are aiming to intentionally destroy the economy so that they can increase their political power? That seems less likely to me than either simple racism or a poor understanding of economics.

Of course, a poor understanding of economics can be nearly as damaging as actual malice...

Re: When the U.S. tried to replace migrant farmworkers with high schoolers (2018)

#56

Post by collingreen »

rib3ye wrote: post #43
LAC-Tech wrote: post #20

is "Migrant" a euphemism here for "illegal migrant"? If your business needs illegal labour, then it's not a viable business, and it should die. If your pay is so low that no one wants to do your work, why should you be able to break the law with impunity because your business can't compete? Innovate, or die.

Would you rather your tax dollars were used to subsidize farmers or do you just want to pay more for food?

What's the difference?

Re: When the U.S. tried to replace migrant farmworkers with high schoolers (2018)

#57

Post by potato3732842 »

mmooss wrote: post #23
ipnon wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that it's physically difficult. You don't have to lift very heavy or have much knowhow other than how to remove a husk from a corncob. But it's incredibly toilsome and boring. You get bussed out from your city or town for a few hours to the middle of nowhere. You bring a gallon of water and don your hat for shade. Then you trudge along endless rows of corn, husking and husking. The corn literally goes as far…

> It's not that it's physically difficult. The OP very strongly disagrees, as do other descriptions I've read. People here are talking about all farm work as the same thing; I think that betrays complete ignorance.

I'm sorry, but this hand wringing is just a joke.

Farm work ain't great. It's repetitive and rarely if ever ergonomic. There's plenty of reasons anybody who can do something more skilled or better paid does. But it's way less taxing than just about any job where the tool used is a shovel or sledgehammer.

Yeah, if your frame of reference is skilled work or office work it all sucks but there's very much degrees to it.

Re: When the U.S. tried to replace migrant farmworkers with high schoolers (2018)

#58

Post by cybercity »

ipnon wrote: post #9
emidoots wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Teenagers young and older are definitely still working on fields here in the US[0], and also a good portion now work the processing facilities instead[1][2]. Whether it qualifies as 'an honest day's work' these days - or a cruel and punishing existence - I'll leave for you to decide. [0] https://youtu.be/41vETgarh_8?si=S0dBolFjv04SSprh&t=497 [1] https://www.npr.org/2023/09/25/1201524399/child-labor-perdue... [2] http…

It's a good point. I'm speaking of high school who are allowed to legally work in the state of Iowa. If a 16 year old willfully employing themself in an entry level job is considered exploitative child labor to you, I don't know what to say. One sad effect of the changes in labor in the state is that only citizens are beholden to labor laws, whereas those working under the table are not. So it's true there is child l…

Americans should be deeply ashamed of themselves if they think it is okay to have 16 year olds do field labour. The bar just keeps getting lower.

Re: When the U.S. tried to replace migrant farmworkers with high schoolers (2018)

#59

Post by hollerith »

cybercity wrote: post #58
ipnon wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a good point. I'm speaking of high school who are allowed to legally work in the state of Iowa. If a 16 year old willfully employing themself in an entry level job is considered exploitative child labor to you, I don't know what to say. One sad effect of the changes in labor in the state is that only citizens are beholden to labor laws, whereas those working under the table are not. So it's true there is child l…

Americans should be deeply ashamed of themselves if they think it is okay to have 16 year olds do field labour. The bar just keeps getting lower.

No thanks.

Re: When the U.S. tried to replace migrant farmworkers with high schoolers (2018)

#60

Post by hitekker »

ipnon wrote: post #2

This sounds quite sinister but it was a common summer job in Iowa for teenagers. You could make enough in a summer to buy a used car. Because of immigration these jobs are not really available for citizens anymore. I haven't heard of any teenagers taking this work in some time. You had to work long hours in the sun and heat but it was "an honest day's work."

It's definitely true that early farm employment can deprive children of opportunity, and cause a knock-down effect on their education. Your naysayers are right to cite how exploitative these illegal farming employments are.

But the rest of the reaction seems a little out of place. Maybe it's a major culture difference: we're mostly cosmopolitan white collars with luxury time & luxury salaries, and they're our rural countrymen working with their hands and having to make ends meet.

Is it our place to judge them so harshly?

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