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VW Group Collects Vehicle Movement Data

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Re: VW Group Collects Vehicle Movement Data

#51

Post by fock »

lnsru wrote: post #25
Etheryte wrote: post #8

Germany makes a big ruckus about their local industry struggling to compete with Chinese manufacturers, but meanwhile the Volkswagen Group stumbles from one scandal to the next. As far as I'm concerned, if that's the way you do business, go bankrupt. I know all big manufacturers have their warts and flaws, but VW continues to be the frontrunner year after year.

I guess it’s the lack of everything in a partially state owned company. Here you go: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_Act They don’t really think about competition. That’s an arena for power fights, empire building and incompetence on every level. Think about software and Cariad disaster. Cars were a byproduct. Germans associated them for generations with good life and bought without thinking. I would say,…

state-owned company where the 2 families owning the majority of shares block using the earnings to do any investment. The only thing were the state-stake comes into play is in not crushing unions in Germany (which they don't mind doing in the US) and not letting the whole enterprise fail (which it should ...)

Re: VW Group Collects Vehicle Movement Data

#52

Post by dirkt »

Etheryte wrote: post #8

Germany makes a big ruckus about their local industry struggling to compete with Chinese manufacturers, but meanwhile the Volkswagen Group stumbles from one scandal to the next. As far as I'm concerned, if that's the way you do business, go bankrupt. I know all big manufacturers have their warts and flaws, but VW continues to be the frontrunner year after year.

Don't forget that other manufacturers collect the same data, they just didn't have a collection of blunders that allowed access. No malicious intent this time, but it clearly highlights that companies need to learn to put policies in place to make double sure PII is actually protected to the degree the law already requires. We also need laws that force companies to make opting out of this kind of data collection much easier, or to make it opt-in in the first place.

Re: VW Group Collects Vehicle Movement Data

#53

Post by gambiting »

TacticalCoder wrote: post #38
harha wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EU is also quite involved by making sure that a car can’t simply be a car anymore but needs a lot of complex systems that may ore may not work as intended, like remote capabilities etc.

It's all part of a plan. The EU is very busy setting up the equivalent of the chinese "social credit". It started with "ESG" rating by banks (where you're already attributed an ESG rating depending on which companies you invest your money in) and now it's likely they'll be moving forward with computing your yearly carbon emission to then decide if you can go on vacation or not and how far. Don't underestimate the glo…

>>People should vote to GTFO of the EU

Being in the EU is literally the best thing that has ever happened to my country, and it continues being an incredible benefit to everyone here. The suggestion that we would be better off out of the EU is actually insane.

>>And, no, I'm not seeing things.

Fantastic, that means it should be trivial to provide sources for everything you've said.

Re: VW Group Collects Vehicle Movement Data

#55

Post by gambiting »

tempodox wrote: post #22

So we have cookie consent banners for web sites but in a car the manufacturer can just steal all the data they want…

Oh you do agree to it when you start the car for the first time, so it's not any different than cookie consent banners in that sense. It's just meaningless because you can't not agree to it.

Re: VW Group Collects Vehicle Movement Data

#56

Post by gambiting »

TacticalCoder wrote: post #40
fidotron wrote: post #29

Ever since cars started having cell modems in “for emergencies” it has been clear governments are encouraging this sort of thing to enable mass population monitoring. It is practically mandatory for manufacturers to do this. Thanks to Starlink it is also possible for a private entity to track every device with cellular access. I don’t think people on here are ready for quite where all this goes.

> I don’t think people on here are ready for quite where all this goes. Exactly. People should vote for less government and should vote for those willing to defend freedom of speech. Actually: we're heading towards that dystopian future because of all the government lovers and apologists. There are only 40% of the EU citizens that don't want the EU. It's not enough.

>>There are only 40% of the EU citizens that don't want the EU.

40% of EU citizens are not right in their heads then. That number should be a lot smaller.

Re: VW Group Collects Vehicle Movement Data

#57

Post by ahartmetz »

perch56 wrote: post #54

Funny enough, ‘Cariad’ translates to ‘hell chariot’ in Romanian—a name that feels oddly fitting given this fiasco.

Imagine how bad software development in car companies must be - it's worse than that in reality. A giant clusterfuck of incompetence, especially from the top.

Re: VW Group Collects Vehicle Movement Data

#58

Post by fidotron »

TacticalCoder wrote: post #40
fidotron wrote: post #29

Ever since cars started having cell modems in “for emergencies” it has been clear governments are encouraging this sort of thing to enable mass population monitoring. It is practically mandatory for manufacturers to do this. Thanks to Starlink it is also possible for a private entity to track every device with cellular access. I don’t think people on here are ready for quite where all this goes.

> I don’t think people on here are ready for quite where all this goes. Exactly. People should vote for less government and should vote for those willing to defend freedom of speech. Actually: we're heading towards that dystopian future because of all the government lovers and apologists. There are only 40% of the EU citizens that don't want the EU. It's not enough.

That is only half of the story.

The other half is what government there is should be doing a lot more to protect the privacy of people on their territory from foreign state and private entities.

Re: VW Group Collects Vehicle Movement Data

#59

Post by epolanski »

Earw0rm wrote: post #50
Etheryte wrote: post #8

Germany makes a big ruckus about their local industry struggling to compete with Chinese manufacturers, but meanwhile the Volkswagen Group stumbles from one scandal to the next. As far as I'm concerned, if that's the way you do business, go bankrupt. I know all big manufacturers have their warts and flaws, but VW continues to be the frontrunner year after year.

As you've brought China into this, which is the greater scandal? 1) VW Group collects data on its customers. 2) Chinese-made vehicles have potential two-way telemetry and control (we don't know, it's closed-source), and we've just allowed tens of thousands of 1.5-tonne, potentially autonomous vehicles with goodness-knows-what sensor packages, plenty of demonstrated ability to kill, injure, catch fire or block critica…

2) is ridiculous speculation and fearmongering. Why shouldn't I feel the same about Tesla's or any other car?

I don't care how much media tries to brainwash us that China is my enemy, facts are that there are way more tangible proofs of all us being consistently spied by US-led agencies, we have proof that from dams to electrical grids the US has one button methods to create chaos in most of the world, and yet, people consistently go into these far fetching anti Chinese speculation when the proof is that the spying, meddling boogeyman is in Washington.

This all feels like the usual US exceptionalism, where the only country that is exceptional and allowed to ignore rules is US, and others cannot.

Re: VW Group Collects Vehicle Movement Data

#60

Post by mejutoco »

bboygravity wrote: post #17
Rygian wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a person whose job is to prioritize. If that person, and that person's management, think that security and privacy are a priority, then things get fixed.

Where's the incentive for company leadership to spend resources on security currently? As long as there's no incentive to improve security, there will be no security. Examples of incentive: laws. Fix security or you can't sell your product, if you can't sell product you don't get a bonus or get fired. Don't gather location data if it's not critical for the functioning of the car or you can't sell your product, etc.

GDPR already exists. It just needs to be enforced in this context.
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