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BYD quarterly sales beat Tesla for first time

ft.com

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Re: BYD quarterly sales beat Tesla for first time

#51

Post by onlyrealcuzzo »

polartx wrote: post #29
ApolloFortyNine wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only reason they wouldn't take off outside China is the astronomical tariffs the West are putting on Chinese cars (100% in the US). Though depending on the wording, they may be able to just build a plant in Mexico and take advantage of NAFTA. I can't tell from the whitehouse post on the tariff if it's tied to country of the manufacturer or just country of origin (usually it's origin).

Or if the build quality of their vehicles was not up to par with US regulation or the quality standards the US market is accustomed to..which seems very possible given the connotations generally shared domestically around the phrase “made in china”

"Made in China" in the US typically means "made cheaply" - which, if you look at what people buy, is actually what people typically want.

You get what you pay for.

In the case of electric cars, China has their own domestic market that actually wants to drive a decent car, and so they are building for that.

BYD cars aren't particularly "cheap" in the way a "Made in China" spatula is.

Re: BYD quarterly sales beat Tesla for first time

#53

Post by [deleted] »

worik wrote: post #28
toomuchtodo wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2024-10-16/electric-... | https://archive.today/uJLa4 ("Bloomberg: BYD Is Winning the Global Race to Make Cheaper EVs") > Last fall in Malta, BYD began selling the Atto 3, an all-electric compact crossover. Strip away the company’s futuristic logo, and it looks almost indistinguishable from other small, sporty SUVs. But inside it’s full of treats, including heated seats in vega…

https://www.bydauto.co.nz/vehicles/atto-3 US$31,087.42 for the same car in New Zealand Frustrating

[deleted]

Re: BYD quarterly sales beat Tesla for first time

#54

Post by discreteevent »

SiempreViernes wrote: post #26
kelnos wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is when it's not fair competition. Certainly Tesla has received government subsidies, but I expect their numbers to pale in comparison to whatever money the Chinese government has directly and indirectly poured into BYD. Flooding foreign markets with your heavily-subsidized cars in order to kill your competition is great for you, but not so great for competitors in the market of sale.

And under capitalism, why should I care for the competitors? That unprofitable companies die is what is supposed to drive efficiency! Why mourn the death of a rent seeker?

Unprofitable inefficient companies don't die if governments keep propping them up. What they are doing is not capitalism.

Re: BYD quarterly sales beat Tesla for first time

#55

Post by _mlbt »

FileSorter wrote: post #47
bhouston wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ...they may be able to just build a plant in Mexico and take advantage of NAFTA. If Trump is elected, expect then NAFTA to be changed to exclude competitors to Tesla in some fashion. There is already a lot of expectations that a Trump win will heavily benefit Elon: https://www.nytimes.com/2024/10/29/business/economy/elon-mus...

God forbid a US automaker benefit for providing Americans jobs

Exactly. People are all for globalization until it comes for their specific industry and job. I remember there being a great uproar and gnashing of teeth over the outsourcing of IT jobs to Asia back in the 90s and 00s, yet now there’s something wrong with protecting one of America’s remaining big manufacturing industries.

Re: BYD quarterly sales beat Tesla for first time

#56

Post by adriancr »

teruakohatu wrote: post #37
linkgoron wrote: post #23

I've been happily driving a BYD Atto 3 for ~6 months now. Very happy with it, its got a lot of nice software and hardware features, carplay/android auto works well, driving is nice and very smooth (especially on sport mode), and my daughter loves playing with the "strings" on the doors. The most glaring issue is the battery which is really its weakest part. Is it better than a Tesla? Probably not - there are clearly…

> The most glaring issue is the battery which is really its weakest part. What are the issues? I thought BYD batteries were as good as they get? I am pretty sure Teslas sold in my country (NZ) have BYD batteries.

> What are the issues? I thought BYD batteries were as good as they get?

BYD atto 3 that OP mentioned:

- 420km wltp range on 60 kwh battery.

Tesla model 3 rwd:

- 554km wltp with 18" wheels - on 56kwh battery.

so tesla is much more efficient while cost difference isnt that much at least in europe. (41k vs 39k)

Re: BYD quarterly sales beat Tesla for first time

#57

Post by asdajksah2123 »

Etheryte wrote: post #3

Only 7.9 percent of all of their sales is outside of China. They can generate fancy numbers galore on domestic soil where they have both production subsidies as well as government aid for buying said vehicles, but it's very unclear how they're going to fare outside of China.

Selling a ton of cars in China, where the competition is fierce, is no mean feat.

Re: BYD quarterly sales beat Tesla for first time

#58

Post by tivert »

ApolloFortyNine wrote: post #9
Etheryte wrote: post #3

Only 7.9 percent of all of their sales is outside of China. They can generate fancy numbers galore on domestic soil where they have both production subsidies as well as government aid for buying said vehicles, but it's very unclear how they're going to fare outside of China.

Only reason they wouldn't take off outside China is the astronomical tariffs the West are putting on Chinese cars (100% in the US). Though depending on the wording, they may be able to just build a plant in Mexico and take advantage of NAFTA. I can't tell from the whitehouse post on the tariff if it's tied to country of the manufacturer or just country of origin (usually it's origin).

> Only reason they wouldn't take off outside China is the astronomical tariffs the West are putting on Chinese cars (100% in the US).

Yeah, due to Chinese state subsidies and other assistance, China has a competitive advantage in automobile manufacturing as well as in many other areas. The US needs to show its commitment to free market principles and lets its auto industry die already.

Re: BYD quarterly sales beat Tesla for first time

#59

Post by churchill »

echelon wrote: post #31
ApolloFortyNine wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only reason they wouldn't take off outside China is the astronomical tariffs the West are putting on Chinese cars (100% in the US). Though depending on the wording, they may be able to just build a plant in Mexico and take advantage of NAFTA. I can't tell from the whitehouse post on the tariff if it's tied to country of the manufacturer or just country of origin (usually it's origin).

> Only reason they wouldn't take off outside China is the astronomical tariffs the West are putting on Chinese cars (100% in the US). They're dumping domestic overproduction on foreign markets. You do that long enough and you can weaken your foreign competitors in their domestic strongholds. This can destroy high-value domestic jobs, lead to atrophy of expertise, and is especially bad to "strategic" sectors of the do…

Western cope never gets old. Western automakers had the chance to dominate international markets, but they stayed back at home, making overpriced cars for their captive audience of local buyers.

Whenever competitors showed up, they laughed at them, before panicking when those upstarts starting challenging their market dominance. It happened with Japan, Korea, and now China.

So, if you feel China competes unfairly, close off your markets. Countries without a local auto industry will accept Chinese EVs readily. BYD & co. will snatch American & EU automakers' foreign markets before they come home to swallow you alive by building factories in low-cost countries like Bulgaria, Mexico, & Brazil.

Basically, the Toyota cycle will repeat itself because Western (esp. American) automakers spent hundreds of billions on share buybacks instead of R&D.

Re: BYD quarterly sales beat Tesla for first time

#60

Post by jajko »

pclmulqdq wrote: post #46
teruakohatu wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The most glaring issue is the battery which is really its weakest part. What are the issues? I thought BYD batteries were as good as they get? I am pretty sure Teslas sold in my country (NZ) have BYD batteries.

If OP is comparing their experience in your BYD to Tesla's marketing material, that's not a correct comparison. Tesla battery ranges should generally be derated quite a bit to align them with how the rest of the industry measures range.

And that goes only for rather flat terrain and non-cold environments. Otherwise the discrepancies end up just like consumption of ICE engines in ads vs reality.
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