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Dear CTO: it's not 2015 anymore

blog.godfreyai.com

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Re: Dear CTO: it's not 2015 anymore

#51

Post by ckmiaomix »

realitychx2020 wrote: post #30
ckmiaomix wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Author here! Came when I saw my Substack blowing up. This isn't to imply that engineers are universally treated well, but that RELATIVE to other workers, they held far more bargaining power and faced better working conditions across the board. Most companies outside of the tech bubble don't even have the concept of unlimited PTO. There's probably something broader to be said re: this point on bargaining power of work…

>> This isn't to imply that engineers are universally treated well, but that RELATIVE to other workers, they held far more bargaining power and faced better working conditions across the board. Most companies outside of the tech bubble don't even have the concept of unlimited PTO. One might also argue that US residents disagree with you so much that they arent applying to tech jobs in sufficient quanities. The pay an…

I'd actually really like to believe that what you've written is true. If hundreds and thousands of tech workers were empowered toliterally quit the workforce if their higher needs weren't met, I'd be DELIGHTED.

But the reality is that the jobs with "real perks" are really hard to get and few and far between. They require powerful networks, timing, and luck. Most of the folks I know who were impacted by the recent layoffs just want a place where they can make a good living and feel appreciated.

Re: Dear CTO: it's not 2015 anymore

#52

Post by ckmiaomix »

collingreen wrote: post #47
ckmiaomix wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hi! Author here - that's actually...kinda the point. The good treatment you mentioned doesn't organically happen. Your leaders have to fight for it and maintain it. And eng leaders...just aren't in the fight right now. If good eng leaders actually stepped up and brought the ethos of enabling creativity, autonomy, and well-being to the rest of the org, everyone would be in a better place.

That point did not come through AT ALL. Your article reads like the exact opposite - it has nothing about encouraging engineering leaders to spread humane work environments to other departments or even a suggestion that people deserve it. You called engineers "spoiled rotten".

LOL read literally the last 4 paragraphs.

"Other functions would do well to bring the same kind of focus on enabling productivity, happiness, and autonomy to their workers. In fact, CTOs-turned-CEOs I know tend to be some of the most kind, creative, and abundance-minded leaders I’ve ever had the pleasure to work with. They have an inherent understanding on the importance of culture and making people feel valued."

Re: Dear CTO: it's not 2015 anymore

#53

Post by ckmiaomix »

whatshisface wrote: post #17

This article sort of gets it, but misses it in the end. Engineering essentially "works for" product management because the product is the value they provide, and the product people ultimately are the ones who defend the resources required to realize their plans. If you are an engineer, the person who goes to leadership with plans that require you to work is your number one internal advocate. ...and for what it's wort…

Product management's job is not to explain engineering. Engineering does not work for product management. Product's job is to figure out what to build by working with all stakeholders and customer input.

Re: Dear CTO: it's not 2015 anymore

#54

Post by freefaler »

zb1plus wrote: post #15

The further I go into my career, the more see the it the opposite way. I think business people are overvalued compared with most software engineers. If software engineers take the time to learn the "business", they can build their own companies that eclipse those started by the typical MBAs who view engineers as "pampered and coddled" cost centers. I think after the bubble pops, we'll see new companies that led by en…

It's not that skills prevents starting a company, it's the amount of risk & uncertainty people are happy to live with. Programmers like predictability because what you'd do if your compiler gave a different result every time you compile your code?

A rational person getting a 300K salary would be better off on average than a small business owner after 5 years.

Sales people are paid a high percentage of the deal they close because they need to produce a consistent result in inconsistent environment. Also businesses can easily measure the output of a sales person, but it's way harder to measure a programmers output in a larger team.

Re: Dear CTO: it's not 2015 anymore

#55

Post by [deleted] »

orev wrote: post #20

Software engineering (and many other parts of IT) is at its core a creative process, and the “coddling” is what creates an environment where creativity becomes possible. You can’t get into the zone/flow if you’re constantly worried about who’s trying to screw you over, or when you feel you have a gun to your head about some metric you need to hit. Of course those things are going to happen, this is work after all, bu…

[deleted]

Re: Dear CTO: it's not 2015 anymore

#56

Post by ramesh31 »

smackay wrote: post #8

This is a re-run of the end of the first dot-com boom where the rest of the organisation got some payback against the pampered and coddled engineers who built the web sites in between foosball games. Except this time around when your engineers are able to create agents, what do you need the rest of the organisation for. Software is eating the world, and it's only just getting started.

>Software is eating the world, and it's only just getting started.

More like software is eating software now. I don't think anyone is prepared for the fact that practically all junior/midlevel SWE roles are going to be automated away in the next couple years. We'll look back at the last 20 years as a golden age similar to the 20th century postwar period of manufacturing jobs in the US.

Re: Dear CTO: it's not 2015 anymore

#57

Post by FooBarBizBazz »

collingreen wrote: post #41

This article is a roller coaster of the authors very mixed emotions and thoughts. It hits all the b-school tropes from "workers should be grateful for their employers not the other way around" to "retention is waste" while also saying how valuable engineering is and how the best companies they worked for had leaders that came with the exact mindset being attacked here. Add in a little "see how good of a writer I am"…

The solution is to gleefully disrupt these people. They can't keep doors on airplanes.

Re: Dear CTO: it's not 2015 anymore

#58

Post by ufmace »

aftbit wrote: post #27

IMO, these layoffs are not caused by AI or because Google suddenly doesn't need engineers. Instead, we're seeing at least four effects collide: 1. Growth can't last forever. Big tech is moving from an exponential phase to a sigmoidal one. Expect to see less spending and more focus on efficiency. It takes fewer people to keep the profit engine going than it does to build something totally new from the beginning. 2. Wh…

I feel like all of this is true, but represents the larger background forces. I think a big factor in why it's hitting relatively hard now is the Musk takeover of Twitter - he laid off a ton of engineers, and nothing much happened. I think that was a shock to much of Big Tech that most of their orgs are really feather-bedded with people who aren't actually doing much to support the core business.

Re: Dear CTO: it's not 2015 anymore

#59

Post by [deleted] »

ckmiaomix wrote: post #53
whatshisface wrote: post #17

This article sort of gets it, but misses it in the end. Engineering essentially "works for" product management because the product is the value they provide, and the product people ultimately are the ones who defend the resources required to realize their plans. If you are an engineer, the person who goes to leadership with plans that require you to work is your number one internal advocate. ...and for what it's wort…

Product management's job is not to explain engineering. Engineering does not work for product management. Product's job is to figure out what to build by working with all stakeholders and customer input.

[deleted]

Re: Dear CTO: it's not 2015 anymore

#60

Post by bluepizza »

ckmiaomix wrote: post #52
collingreen wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That point did not come through AT ALL. Your article reads like the exact opposite - it has nothing about encouraging engineering leaders to spread humane work environments to other departments or even a suggestion that people deserve it. You called engineers "spoiled rotten".

LOL read literally the last 4 paragraphs. "Other functions would do well to bring the same kind of focus on enabling productivity, happiness, and autonomy to their workers. In fact, CTOs-turned-CEOs I know tend to be some of the most kind, creative, and abundance-minded leaders I’ve ever had the pleasure to work with. They have an inherent understanding on the importance of culture and making people feel valued."

> LOL read literally the last 4 paragraphs.

OP gave you valuable feedback on how your point is not getting across. Should you edit, or should you lol and snark is a personal choice for you to make. But OP is just trying to help you.

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