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Techniques I use to create a great user experience for shell scripts

nochlin.com

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Re: Techniques I use to create a great user experience for shell scripts

#51

Post by skydhash »

hollerith wrote: post #34
sweeter wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

except for the fact that it is slower than hell and the syntax is nuts. I don't really understand the comparison, bash is basically just command glue for composing pipelines and pwsh is definitely more of a full-fledged language... but to me, I use bash because its quick and dirty and it fits well with the Unix system. If I wanted the features that pwsh brings I would much rather just pick a language like Golang or P…

The fact that it is "basically just command glue for composing pipelines" makes it even more regrettable that it takes more knowledge and mental focus to avoid shooting my foot off in bash than it does in any other programming language I use.

If you're trying to write a full fledged program in it, it's going to be a pain as there are only strings (and arrays, I think). Bash is for scripting. If you have complex logic to be done, use another programming language like perl, ruby, python, $YOUR_PREFERRED_ONE,...

Re: Techniques I use to create a great user experience for shell scripts

#53

Post by AlienRobot »

dvrp wrote: post #41

These are all about passive experiences (which are great don't get me wrong!), but I think you can do better. It's the same phenomenon DHH talked about in the Rails doctrine when he said to "Optimize for programmer happiness". The python excerpt is my favorite example: ``` $ irb irb(main):001:0> exit $ irb irb(main):001:0> quit $ python >>> exit Use exit() or Ctrl-D (i.e. EOF) to exit ``` Ruby accepts both exit and q…

Yes. I'd be surprised if exit without parentheses quit the interactive shell when it doesn't quit a normal python script.

Re: Techniques I use to create a great user experience for shell scripts

#54

Post by pmarreck »

dvrp wrote: post #41

These are all about passive experiences (which are great don't get me wrong!), but I think you can do better. It's the same phenomenon DHH talked about in the Rails doctrine when he said to "Optimize for programmer happiness". The python excerpt is my favorite example: ``` $ irb irb(main):001:0> exit $ irb irb(main):001:0> quit $ python >>> exit Use exit() or Ctrl-D (i.e. EOF) to exit ``` Ruby accepts both exit and q…

this actually completely turned me off from python when I first encountered it. I was like... "the program KNEW WHAT I WAS TRYING TO DO, and instead of just DOING that it ADMONISHED me, fuck Python" LOL

The proliferation of Python has only made my feelings worse. Try running a 6 month old Python project that you haven't touched and see if it still runs. /eyeroll

Re: Techniques I use to create a great user experience for shell scripts

#56

Post by jiggawatts »

skydhash wrote: post #51
hollerith wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that it is "basically just command glue for composing pipelines" makes it even more regrettable that it takes more knowledge and mental focus to avoid shooting my foot off in bash than it does in any other programming language I use.

If you're trying to write a full fledged program in it, it's going to be a pain as there are only strings (and arrays, I think). Bash is for scripting. If you have complex logic to be done, use another programming language like perl, ruby, python, $YOUR_PREFERRED_ONE,...

You’re arguing that the power of PowerShell is pointless because you’ve resorted to alternatives to bash… because it’s not good enough for common scenarios.

This is Stockholm Syndrome.

You’ve internalised your limitations and have grown to like them.

Re: Techniques I use to create a great user experience for shell scripts

#57

Post by pmarreck »

xyzzy4747 wrote: post #22

Not trying to offend anyone here but I think shell scripts are the wrong solution for anything over ~50 lines of code. Use a better programming language. Go, Typescript, Rust, Python, and even Perl come to mind.

Try running a 6 month old Python project that you haven't run in that time and report back.

Meanwhile, 10 year old Bash scripts I've written still run unmodified.

Winner by a mile (from a software-longevity and low-maintenance perspective at least): Bash

Re: Techniques I use to create a great user experience for shell scripts

#60

Post by hinkley »

haileys wrote: post #18

Don't output ANSI colour codes directly - your output could redirect to a file, or perhaps the user simply prefers no colour. Use tput instead, and add a little snippet like this to the top of your script: command -v tput &>/dev/null && [ -t 1 ] && [ -z "${NO_COLOR:-}" ] || tput() { true; } This checks that the tput command exists (using the bash 'command' builtin rather than which(1) - surprisingly, which can't alwa…

There should just be a command for this. Like echo with a color flag that does something if you’re in a tty.
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