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Crypto brothers front-ran the front-runners

bloomberg.com

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Re: Crypto brothers front-ran the front-runners

#51

Post by b0r3datw0rk »

Electricniko wrote: post #46

I feel like the people who wonder why this is a crime are missing something pretty important: this isn't the SEC attempting to regulate a crypto market by prosecuting securities fraud, it's the DOJ prosecuting straight-up old fashioned fraud. The crime is changing the terms of the transaction within the 12 second time frame after it had begun but before it had finished, and ultimately selling something different than…

how is the blockchain under the purview of the us govt? these were transactions submitted to a blockchain created for the sole purpose of not being controlled by the government

all these code is law folks are constantly exposed as just looking to get rich quick

Re: Crypto brothers front-ran the front-runners

#52

Post by tcbawo »

dheera wrote: post #38
akira2501 wrote: post #6

I'm uncomfortable with the tax dollars of hard working people being used to defend the likes of those who use robots with million dollar wallets to rake up the low hanging fruit of digital arbitrage on an entirely unregulated network. They wanted the rewards that came with this risk. Now that they got hustled, they cry foul, and the DOJ is going to spend huge amounts of money litigating their case? Perhaps it is in a…

TFA: "They worry that this microsecond-scale competition between algorithms is socially wasteful" I would LOVE to see a stock market that (a) time-penalizes large orders -- 1 share trades in a microsecond, 10000 shares takes a week to execute OR (b) adds a random time delay to all orders in the range of [0,60] minutes for corporations, [0,10] minutes for residential traders, and [0,1] minutes for people who have prov…

> people who have provably low income

You want to give all your financial info to your brokerage?

What increasing latency will do is widen the markets. We’ll go back to the days of multiple cents or dollars between the bid and offer prices of stocks.

It will definitely increase the time horizon to make an investment profitable. But maybe that’s a societal good for some people…

In the modern era, adding a speed bump might just mean that all the trading moves overseas, to derivatives, or mutual funds. Money finds a way of flowing downhill

Re: Crypto brothers front-ran the front-runners

#53

Post by phyalow »

dheera wrote: post #38
akira2501 wrote: post #6

I'm uncomfortable with the tax dollars of hard working people being used to defend the likes of those who use robots with million dollar wallets to rake up the low hanging fruit of digital arbitrage on an entirely unregulated network. They wanted the rewards that came with this risk. Now that they got hustled, they cry foul, and the DOJ is going to spend huge amounts of money litigating their case? Perhaps it is in a…

TFA: "They worry that this microsecond-scale competition between algorithms is socially wasteful" I would LOVE to see a stock market that (a) time-penalizes large orders -- 1 share trades in a microsecond, 10000 shares takes a week to execute OR (b) adds a random time delay to all orders in the range of [0,60] minutes for corporations, [0,10] minutes for residential traders, and [0,1] minutes for people who have prov…

[flagged]

Re: Crypto brothers front-ran the front-runners

#54

Post by beaeglebeachedd »

phyalow wrote: post #53
dheera wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TFA: "They worry that this microsecond-scale competition between algorithms is socially wasteful" I would LOVE to see a stock market that (a) time-penalizes large orders -- 1 share trades in a microsecond, 10000 shares takes a week to execute OR (b) adds a random time delay to all orders in the range of [0,60] minutes for corporations, [0,10] minutes for residential traders, and [0,1] minutes for people who have prov…

[flagged]

Yeah it'll move offshore, but if you cut off dollar access and list on FATF black list any nation that does it, it will mostly stop, at least while USA has it's current influence. Not saying you should.

Re: Crypto brothers front-ran the front-runners

#55

Post by tmn »

b0r3datw0rk wrote: post #51
Electricniko wrote: post #46

I feel like the people who wonder why this is a crime are missing something pretty important: this isn't the SEC attempting to regulate a crypto market by prosecuting securities fraud, it's the DOJ prosecuting straight-up old fashioned fraud. The crime is changing the terms of the transaction within the 12 second time frame after it had begun but before it had finished, and ultimately selling something different than…

how is the blockchain under the purview of the us govt? these were transactions submitted to a blockchain created for the sole purpose of not being controlled by the government all these code is law folks are constantly exposed as just looking to get rich quick

They did decide they’re entitled to taxes on transactions..

Re: Crypto brothers front-ran the front-runners

#56

Post by OutOfHere »

TacticalCoder wrote: post #39
blackhawkC17 wrote: post #7

I really don’t see what these guys did wrong. Good for them for making away with $25 million…the government should leave them alone. After all, crypto bros wanted decentralized finance where code is law. But they’ll run to the government when someone outsmarts them. Reminds me of people from corrupt countries parking their money in countries with strong rule of law, where they know it can’t be seized without due proc…

The term they googled makes it clear they fully knew they weren't doing something clean. I totally see what they did wrong and here's the proof they knew too: > "allegedly “searched online for, among other things, ‘money laundering,’ ‘exploit,’ ‘computer fraud abuse act,’5 and ‘does the united states extradite to [foreign country]." But you may be seeing different things than others, including the perpetrators of thi…

All those web search terms are relevant for indirectly helping find useful defense attorneys. If doesn't in itself demonstrate any guilt.

I am not saying they're not guilty of fraud, only that a jury needs to be massively more objective than look to such searches as evidence of guilt.

Also, there are probably thousands of people who do the same searches without participating in any fraud.

Re: Crypto brothers front-ran the front-runners

#57

Post by tmn »

akira2501 wrote: post #6

I'm uncomfortable with the tax dollars of hard working people being used to defend the likes of those who use robots with million dollar wallets to rake up the low hanging fruit of digital arbitrage on an entirely unregulated network. They wanted the rewards that came with this risk. Now that they got hustled, they cry foul, and the DOJ is going to spend huge amounts of money litigating their case? Perhaps it is in a…

The government believes it’s entitled to taxes on the usd value of any acquired digital coins/tokens. I’d have more sympathy to your perspective if this wasn’t the case (although I’m still sympathetic)

Re: Crypto brothers front-ran the front-runners

#58

Post by lbwtaylor »

b0r3datw0rk wrote: post #51
Electricniko wrote: post #46

I feel like the people who wonder why this is a crime are missing something pretty important: this isn't the SEC attempting to regulate a crypto market by prosecuting securities fraud, it's the DOJ prosecuting straight-up old fashioned fraud. The crime is changing the terms of the transaction within the 12 second time frame after it had begun but before it had finished, and ultimately selling something different than…

how is the blockchain under the purview of the us govt? these were transactions submitted to a blockchain created for the sole purpose of not being controlled by the government all these code is law folks are constantly exposed as just looking to get rich quick

The fraudsters are American so the US Government certainly has jurisdiction over their actions. Blockchain doesn't really matter to that.
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