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Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

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Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#51

Post by the_other »

derekp7 wrote: post #6

This has been really frustrating to me lately with Microsoft Teams. If I'm in their app, the mute button is a microphone with a line through it (if mute is activated, i.e. if the mic is off). And the icon changes to a microphone without the slash over it to indicate that you are no longer muted. Makes sense. But if I join using the phone app on my phone, the same microphone with a line through it (that means you are…

There's a pretty interesting (to me) aspect of the mic indicator/controller problem: without direct visual feedback, you can't tell what mode your mic is in until _other people_ respond, or don't. It's a very laggy tool in terms of feedback even when it's "on". In fact, you often need to test it two or three times to be sure, because your fellow meeting members might have frozen, might just be thinking before they respond, etc

It's quite different from, say, dark mode, which is pretty obvious when toggled on/off.

So the feature benefits a lot from a visual indicator of current state regardless what you choose to do for the button. It's unsurprising people try to smudge the "state" and "control" together, for the mic more than many other controls.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#52

Post by bee_rider »

kragen wrote: post #30
master-lincoln wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? For me this always made intuitive sense reading it as one and zero, where zero would be off.

this is backwards from the perspective of digital logic circuits physical light switches toggle between closed-circuit and open-circuit, not high and low voltage levels. 'on', where current can flow, is a closed circuit; 'off' is an open circuit in digital logic, when there is a correspondence between closed/open and high/low, the correspondence is virtually always that closed is low and high is open. for example: tt…

Oh, of course that must be what closed circuit meant.

For some reason I just thought “looks like the switches are little doors, like in a floor plan, and they are all closed now” and I never examined it.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#53

Post by NeoTar »

wodenokoto wrote: post #17

In defense of the ambiguity of digital toggles, I’d like to add that this is unsolved on most, if not all, physical light switches in homes and offices. Despite having existed for more than 50 years and most people are using multiple toggles a day with its labels, most people are unaware of the meaning of power symbol ( https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_symbol )

Isn't that a feature and not a bug for light switches?

It's not uncommon to have multiple light switches control a single light socket - switching any of them changes the state of the light, therefore you cannot consistently say state-x = light on, state-y = light-off.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#54

Post by 01HNNWZ0MV43FF »

mapreduce wrote: post #7
Waterluvian wrote: post #3

I can’t find it but one of my favourite designs was a switch with a “light” beside it that lit up when the state was “on.” The best thing was that it also solved the latency of an async operation. You’d click the switch which toggled, and then some moment later the light came on. It felt incredibly satisfying and gave confidence that yes, this interaction has done something.

> I can’t find it but one of my favourite designs was a switch with a “light” beside it that lit up when the state was “on.” So when I revisit that page after a long time and see that the light is lit, does it mean that the state is currently ON or does it mean that the state will change to ON when I click it? How can I tell this by instantly looking at the lit light?

We should go back to checkboxes. The problem here is having the text change and be too clever.

[x] Mute

[ ] Mute

"Oh the X means it's muted"

Windows 95 and probably an older Mac had it all figured out.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#56

Post by dhc02 »

rjmunro wrote: post #45

The absolute worst example of this I have seen is the Tesla dashboard screen UI. It shows a car with labels on it, not buttons, that say "Open". That unambiguously means that the particular part is open. But that's not what it means. The labels are in fact buttons to open the parts, and you have no way of knowing.

Yes! I was just driving a borrowed Tesla this weekend and several times I had a moment of confusion/panic because I thought the trunks were both open.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#57

Post by InCityDreams »

6510 wrote: post #11

I do keep doing it myself but combining multiple things into one button is a bad idea. What if the toggle action is just slightly delayed? What if the system is frozen, do you press toggle again? when do you know your click didn't register? Was freezing not annoying enough by it self?

Are you a British Postmaster?

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#58

Post by NegativeK »

sfn42 wrote: post #38
resters wrote: post #28

A toggle button should show its current state. A checkbox is a good example. Muted [] vs Muted [x] It's pretty obvious. What gets tricky is when designers create UI that does not have as clear a connection between the word used and the visual design, such as: Mute Off [---( )] Mute On [( )---] I have no idea what either of these mean because they include the action in the description of the state.

"Mute" "Unmute" I want a button to tell me what it does if I click it. If you want to show the current status that is a different thing, not a button. A button exists to be clicked, it should communicate what it will do if you click it.

Verbs, not nouns.

Which means making sure that the verb form doesn't sound like the noun form.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#59

Post by rconti »

There are a number of ways to get this wrong. The shuffle button in Spotify on our Tesla is a grey color, and you have to wonder if it's dark ENOUGH a grey to indicate that it's on, or a light grey to indicate that it's off. So then you go to toggle it on and off to see the state change, but actually it's buggy so it doesn't do anything.

When you finally get it to toggle on, you realize the shuffle lines turn GREEN, not dark grey like most of the controls. facepalm

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#60

Post by actionfromafar »

rjmunro wrote: post #45

The absolute worst example of this I have seen is the Tesla dashboard screen UI. It shows a car with labels on it, not buttons, that say "Open". That unambiguously means that the particular part is open. But that's not what it means. The labels are in fact buttons to open the parts, and you have no way of knowing.

Can someone make a car which has none of the complicated stuff?

List of features I want:

- automatic transmission (if ICE)

- bluetooth and FM radio

- no self steering

- cruise control with "follow speed"

- not-batshit-insane self-brake-system (use whatever Volvo uses, it works!)

- good airbags and decent structural integrity

- classic sedan height

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