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What happens when a school bans smartphones? A complete transformation

theguardian.com

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Re: What happens when a school bans smartphones? A complete transformation

#51

Post by blackmesaind »

nyc111 wrote: post #16

Those phones contain all the knowledge the school pretends to teach the students. Techers are worried because they see telephones as competition. This would be a nice experiment: Divide the students into two groups and let one group come to school without phones and let the other group stay home and learn the same material from their phones. If the material to be learned is well-defined I believe that students stayin…

Children, by and large, are not very good at self control. Give them free reign to learn at their own pace, and you will see some do very well, and many do extremely poorly.

The public education system (at least primary/secondary) is not about maximizing a few students' learning potential, but the average education of the collective.

Our current system does need major reforms, but to send kids home with phones to learn on their own? Not an effective solution imo.

Re: What happens when a school bans smartphones? A complete transformation

#52

Post by falcolas »

I have one part approval for this (back in my day, off my lawn, etc). But I also think about how many general tools cell phones replace, and the sudden added cost is a concern.

Flashlight. Probably not necessary 99% of the time at a school, until it is valuable.

Calculator. "Approved" graphing calculator replacements are stupid expensive, in many cases more expensive than the phone they're replacing.

Camera. We didn't have a ton of these at schools in the 80's, but they weren't entirely absent either. Useful for documenting (and yes, perpetuating) bullying.

Music. Even in the stone ages, we had music and headphones. Great for study hall and general focus.

Dictionary/Encyclopedia. Sure, folks can use bound volumes, but that's not a skill they'll use. Searching for things on the internet at large, is absolutely a skill they need.

Anyways, mixed thoughts. I'd say I turned out fine, but I had to re-learn a lot of mis-information innocently passed on by my peers and teachers.

Re: What happens when a school bans smartphones? A complete transformation

#53

Post by wharvle »

teloli wrote: post #49
wharvle wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

School shootings come up a lot in these kinds of conversations. Of course you can run the numbers and realize this plainly falls way below the level at which anyone should be using that use-case as a justification for anything. (nb. the vast majority of school shootings you'll see in the statistics aren't the sort where kids having phones matters, they're e.g. targeted attacks on a single person, gang- or otherwise c…

Oh boy am I glad to live in a first world country where this is not an issue.

To be clear, it's bullshit these are even remotely a real thing we have to worry about in a rich OECD state.

... to be more clear, if you run the numbers, they're still kinda not. Our reaction(s) to them aren't rational (though, one can understand why)

Re: What happens when a school bans smartphones? A complete transformation

#54

Post by Podgajski »

tass wrote: post #39
Podgajski wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why can’t someone just make a phone. I don’t need a phone that plays music or can listen to podcast. I just need a phone that can make calls and make texts. I think their problem is they wanted this phone to still be like a smart phone.

By the time you build a basic phone, adding these features only costs a few cents more, so they include them to increase market share. These days phones are generally built from a SoC which already includes more capabilities than just calls and text, and run an operating system which already supports those capabilities. If you don’t want certain features they can be turned off (check how locked down you can make an i…

You’re not including the fact that they need some sort of wonky website for you to upload photos and add Podcasts. So it’s not just the phone they’re building but the whole infrastructure behind it.

And if what you said is true, then why give these kids light phones in the first place. I’m almost wondering if someone from the light phone company has some connection with that school.

Re: What happens when a school bans smartphones? A complete transformation

#55

Post by goles »

tempest_ wrote: post #4
teeray wrote: post #2

Maybe I'm out of the loop... smartphones are allowed in the first place? When did that happen? In my high school, cell phones and ipods (at the time) were to be in lockers and turned off during the day. It was an insta-detention if you were seen using one.

Those light phones are interesting products and I thought about trying one at one point but seen some mixed reviews.

They're expensive. ~300 USD, while the e-ink and design is nice that's a pretty big bill for something that does less than a modern phone that is also cheaper.

Previous discussion (2020): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21943649

I think the most cost effective solution is probably buying the cheapest used A12+ iPhone one could find. Factory restore, then setup Assistive Access or parental controls, which can limit any ability to install apps or settings without a different passcode to unlock the phone. Have a friend or partner set that passcode so you can't be tempted to add anything smart to your Dumb Phone.

Re: What happens when a school bans smartphones? A complete transformation

#56

Post by galdosdi »

schnitzelstoat wrote: post #11
Podgajski wrote: post #6

I mean, I agree that cell phones can cause interruptions in schools, but doing this at a place like Buxton compared to some of the public schools I’ve taught in, well, that’s a whole different story. “Buxton School is a private, coeducational, college preparatory, boarding and day school for grades 9–12 located in Williamstown, Massachusetts.“ I mean, it’s one thing to take away a kid, cell phone and offer them nothi…

Yeah, it seems like you'd basically always get good outcomes in a school like this. If the students become disruptive instead of just wasting time on their phone it could have a negative impact in many schools.

Look at it the other way -- the fact that even such an elite school was having serious problems when they were allowing smartphones, shows how pernicious their influence is in education. It's like putting a TV with full access cable on every desk in the classroom. It's no wonder literacy is going down instead of up for the first time in decades.

Re: What happens when a school bans smartphones? A complete transformation

#57

Post by hermanradtke »

falcolas wrote: post #52

I have one part approval for this (back in my day, off my lawn, etc). But I also think about how many general tools cell phones replace, and the sudden added cost is a concern. Flashlight. Probably not necessary 99% of the time at a school, until it is valuable. Calculator. "Approved" graphing calculator replacements are stupid expensive, in many cases more expensive than the phone they're replacing. Camera. We didn'…

> how many general tools cell phones replace

The article says the students received phones with some of these tools:

> instead coming with deliberately cumbersome versions of music and mapping apps

Re: What happens when a school bans smartphones? A complete transformation

#58

Post by jrs235 »

amanaplanacanal wrote: post #38
dylan604 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An emergency like active shooter, not your child had an accident. During active shooter situations, the school isn't going to call the parents of the students. They have other things to worry about. The kids are calling their parents directly.

I’m trying to figure out what useful action the parent is going to take in this situation.

They sometimes make things worse by showing and causing problems/disruptions for those trying to get control of the situation.

Re: What happens when a school bans smartphones? A complete transformation

#59

Post by galdosdi »

nyc111 wrote: post #16

Those phones contain all the knowledge the school pretends to teach the students. Techers are worried because they see telephones as competition. This would be a nice experiment: Divide the students into two groups and let one group come to school without phones and let the other group stay home and learn the same material from their phones. If the material to be learned is well-defined I believe that students stayin…

Obviously you don't have kids and don't work with kids and your only experience with children in your childless social circle is vaguely remembering your own childhood.

Kids aren't looking at Wikipedia on their phones. Statistically speaking, they are probably looking at some AI generated TikTok video compilation of funny inside jokes, or something.

> The only good thing about the school is that you get to hang out with your peers.

Not if all your peers are too zombied out looking at their phones everytime they get a free moment between classes

Re: What happens when a school bans smartphones? A complete transformation

#60

Post by rapind »

falcolas wrote: post #52

I have one part approval for this (back in my day, off my lawn, etc). But I also think about how many general tools cell phones replace, and the sudden added cost is a concern. Flashlight. Probably not necessary 99% of the time at a school, until it is valuable. Calculator. "Approved" graphing calculator replacements are stupid expensive, in many cases more expensive than the phone they're replacing. Camera. We didn'…

I don't remember needing a fancy calculator until Engineering in University. Possibly they are now needed in High School, but I haven't heard that before?

The article actually addresses the lack of camera as a positive in that it greatly increased interest in photography courses.

The Light Phone they are using can have some basic utility features like a music player, calculator, calendar, etc.

That being said, I'm cynical this is just an ad for Light Phones lol.

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