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How to forget what you read

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Re: How to forget what you read

#51

Post by Tallain »

bunderbunder wrote: post #47
Tallain wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can anecdotally support the criticism of Anki / SRS for language learning, at least as far as rote word definition memorization goes. While learning Thai -- which is a difficult language already -- I continually struggled with word definitions that should have been easy. How hard is it to remember the words for the various parts of your head and body? With just word definitions, apparently, it's really , really har…

So, here's where it gets wild: a couple years ago I stumbled across a study with two treatment groups. The first group was just given graded readers targeting certain vocabulary, and was asked to read them as much as they like. The second was given the same graded readers, but also asked to use flashcards to review the target vocabulary. So, the flashcard group was just using flashcards as a supplement to extensive r…

That is super interesting. Do you happen to have a link still? I'd love to learn more. I wonder how applicable it is to learning new languages as opposed to new words in a native / near-native language.

Re: How to forget what you read

#52

Post by skydhash »

jbstack wrote: post #49
skydhash wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe the process is what got you there, not space repetition itself. Creating a moment of time to revisit concept is a core of all the successful methods I’ve seen.

How do you know when is the optimal time for those revisits? Is it a week later, then a month later, then 6 months later? How do you make that decision? What method will you use to revisit? Will you locate the original book, find the right page, re-read the passage? Or perhaps you'll go to the right section in your notebook and re-read that? Any time you do all of that you're essentially doing what Anki does but in a…

I don't really care about optimal. When the needs arise or my interest has renewed, I do what you said if I can't recall the exact things, I go back to the original source. I'm not really interested in memorizing random facts, I prefer everything to be connected in an organic manner, preferably based on my interest, needs, or context.

Re: How to forget what you read

#53

Post by bunderbunder »

Tallain wrote: post #51
bunderbunder wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, here's where it gets wild: a couple years ago I stumbled across a study with two treatment groups. The first group was just given graded readers targeting certain vocabulary, and was asked to read them as much as they like. The second was given the same graded readers, but also asked to use flashcards to review the target vocabulary. So, the flashcard group was just using flashcards as a supplement to extensive r…

That is super interesting. Do you happen to have a link still? I'd love to learn more. I wonder how applicable it is to learning new languages as opposed to new words in a native / near-native language.

I don't; I usually don't bother to save links to SLA papers because it's not my field of study and my Zotero is already cluttered enough as it is.

It's not terribly hard to find examples of second language acquisition researchers expressing skepticism about flashcarding, though. I don't necessarily find all of it universally convincing (if I did, I wouldn't have 99 reviews left to do today in my 中文 deck), but I do have to admit that a lot of the evidence people claim in support of using spaced repetition systems for language learning has the look of pseudoscience. It largely consists of taking some very limited, tightly focused lab studies, and massively over-extrapolating from them.

But I wouldn't want to over-extrapolate from the studies that claim flashcarding doesn't help, either. The protocols often focus on a very minimalist implementation of flashcarding that's easy to study. Or the protocol is really designed to test some theory about how memory works and not some theory about study strategy. (This second example describes basically all of Ebbinghaus's work, by the way.) One could easily argue, for example, that using a flashcarding application to rote memorize a pre-made deck of words and phrases that somebody else chose is a fundamentally different practice from sentence mining your input materials.

Re: How to forget what you read

#54

Post by rramadass »

jlengrand wrote: post #23

I've done something quite simple that has worked for me this year. I read with a highlighter pen, just highlighting the places I find interesting, and maybe cornering a few pages once in a while. That costs no more energy than just reading the book, if anything highlighting allows my mind to stay focused on the book. couple weeks after the book is finished, I'll come back only to the highlighted parts and write some…

Having a A4 size book summary along with the book itself is a Great Technique! The chapter/book actionable task(s) idea is also great.

Did you come up with the idea yourself or were inspired from some place else? Any more ideas you can share?

Re: How to forget what you read

#55

Post by jlengrand »

rramadass wrote: post #54
jlengrand wrote: post #23

I've done something quite simple that has worked for me this year. I read with a highlighter pen, just highlighting the places I find interesting, and maybe cornering a few pages once in a while. That costs no more energy than just reading the book, if anything highlighting allows my mind to stay focused on the book. couple weeks after the book is finished, I'll come back only to the highlighted parts and write some…

Having a A4 size book summary along with the book itself is a Great Technique! The chapter/book actionable task(s) idea is also great. Did you come up with the idea yourself or were inspired from some place else? Any more ideas you can share?

The second one I picked up from https://www.youtube.com/@askvinh, found it a good idea.

The summary thing, honestly it's just because I was frustrated to feel like I had forgotten everything about the books I read a few weeks later, so I decided to find a reason to go back to them to try and retain more :).

The only other tip I can think of is to start a book club at your workplace. It's a great way to commit to it a bit more while getting suggestions you wouldn't have had yourself.

Re: How to forget what you read

#56

Post by rramadass »

jlengrand wrote: post #55
rramadass wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having a A4 size book summary along with the book itself is a Great Technique! The chapter/book actionable task(s) idea is also great. Did you come up with the idea yourself or were inspired from some place else? Any more ideas you can share?

The second one I picked up from https://www.youtube.com/@askvinh , found it a good idea. The summary thing, honestly it's just because I was frustrated to feel like I had forgotten everything about the books I read a few weeks later, so I decided to find a reason to go back to them to try and retain more :). The only other tip I can think of is to start a book club at your workplace. It's a great way to commit to it…

Your A4 summary page technique is ingenious. It forces one to focus on the absolute essentials gleaned while reading a book rather than fluff which is actually an art in "Note-taking". It is the same as "Precis Writing" but for a book.

In case you didn't already know, you might find the following useful;

1) SQ3R - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SQ3R

2) Cornell Note-taking method - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cornell_Notes

Re: How to forget what you read

#57

Post by [deleted] »

Liebnitz wrote: post #3

As Katarina Janoskova says, "So you read a book. You finished it, liked it, maybe even recommended it to others. It changed your life slightly while you were reading it and for a bit afterwards. And then you moved on with your life." I like that. That says it more succinctly.

[deleted]

Re: How to forget what you read

#58

Post by eye-robot »

Liebnitz wrote: post #3

As Katarina Janoskova says, "So you read a book. You finished it, liked it, maybe even recommended it to others. It changed your life slightly while you were reading it and for a bit afterwards. And then you moved on with your life." I like that. That says it more succinctly.

To be honest, I would love to forget some books I read and re-live the thrill of being startled by the plot again.

To be perfectly honest, I'd love to be startled by the plot the first time round

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