Reckless DMCA Deindexing Pushes NASA's Artemis Towards Black Hole • Hacker News Board

Re: Reckless DMCA Deindexing Pushes NASA's Artemis Towards Black Hole

#51

Post by bawolff » Wed, Dec 27, 2023, 6:51 PM UTC

cultureswitch wrote: post #42

bawolff wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

DMCA isn't the thing allowing this, its big companies taking dmca notices at face value and just acting on them without caring.

The DMCA forces them to act this way.

It somewhat encourages companies to act this way by making it the safest path, but it absolutely does not force them to. Service providers are not required to act on invalid dmca requests.

Consider wikipedia which regularly rejects most [1] of the dmca notices it gets because it cares enough to actually read them and ignore the ones that are bullshit.

[1] according to https://wikimediafoundation.org/about/transparency/2023-1/dm... in a 6 month period they got 29 dmca requests and ignored 27 of them.

Re: Reckless DMCA Deindexing Pushes NASA's Artemis Towards Black Hole

#52

Post by rockskon » Wed, Dec 27, 2023, 8:40 PM UTC

voakbasda wrote: post #48

rockskon wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cynicism like this is poison for changing the political system. Not only have you ceded all ground to the copyright industry - you also discourage others from trying to make a difference. The public isn't as powerless to enact change as you make them out to be.

Yes the public is powerless. Nothing short of revolution will change the status quo. Until then, not a god damn thing will ever make a meaningful change away from the direction things are heading. The people have lost control of the government.

LARPing will not change things, no.

People here, if organized, could absolutely change things especially considering the resources at the financial disposal of those here.

No, I don't mean issues like what you see endlessly litigated on the news. There's countless other issues that barely get any attention in the news such as - Copyright! Not to abolish it - that will never happen, but changes are absolutely possible.

Re: Reckless DMCA Deindexing Pushes NASA's Artemis Towards Black Hole

#53

Post by microtherion » Wed, Dec 27, 2023, 11:33 PM UTC

anigbrowl wrote: post #23

neilv wrote: post #11

Web site that profits from widespread copyright violation-- decries the flawed legal mechanisms that widespread copyright violation enabled. DMCA has serious problems in practice, and needs correcting. But the piracy community should not be the ones criticizing every time a merchant ship has a gunpowder accident from the cannons they're required to carry because of the pirates .

Digital piracy took off in part because copyright restrictions were so unreasonable and onerous to begin with. Copyright was last extended to its current absurd length in 1998, and its provisions were retroactive, which is arguably unconstitutional. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_Term_Extension_Act

I agree that current copyright terms are too long, but for your causality argument to hold water, the bulk of piracy would have to occur for works older than 17 years (the initial copyright term), and I very much doubt that this is the case.

Re: Reckless DMCA Deindexing Pushes NASA's Artemis Towards Black Hole

#54

Post by pbhjpbhj » Thu, Dec 28, 2023, 12:52 AM UTC

hakfoo wrote: post #50

cultureswitch wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disconnecting the economic rent from the value of a piece of cultural to each individual is a horrid idea. Culture, like everything else, is subject to the pareto principle. A handful of works are so much better than the rest that they capture almost all of the money that the public is willing to part with. This is true regardless of economic system.

I question the ability of the market to measure quality. Note I'm not talking about 'commercially successful', but enduring, historic/academic quality. Even though they made bazillions, will students in the high schools of 2523 be reading through scripts of Friends and Breaking Bad the way we slogged through King Lear and Othello? What makes it to market is already a constrained selection. It has to make it through a…

>Note I'm not talking about 'commercially successful', but enduring, historic/academic quality.

Thanks for giving us your position; I think I'm generally in agreement with you.

Here though it's good to note that [at least] one type of historic importance develops over time.

Die Hard, to take an arbitrary example, might not have been an important film as far as its art or technical quality [I don't know, it's not important to my point] but its enduring nature and position as an icon -- as a sort of mainstream but somehow counter-cultural part of Christmas for those of us of a certain age and certain bent -- makes it important when otherwise it would not be. It's not intrinsic to the artwork but emerges out of the societal response to the work.

In the UK we've been paying for the BBC to make culturally responsive TV for decades, yet somehow it all got tied back up in copyright when really it should be publicly owned and free-libre to anyone who will pay the download costs [and, perhaps, has a "TV License"].