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B-trees in Factorio

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Re: B-trees in Factorio

#51

Post by wolletd »

rollcat wrote: post #37
jon_richards wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In Factorio, the meta you want to be searching for is "mixed belt" design, it seems. A more specific case is the "sushi belt" where one belt balances multiple ingredients while looping around on itself. Sometimes they just accept new items in a fixed ratio, sometimes they can actually rebalance if disturbed. This is my favorite https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Gt5Zx0bsOQ While that one uses the in-game circuitry lo…

If you'd like to see sushi belts pushed to absurd levels, check out DoshDoshington: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bRi1ykIeHg

Also DocJade: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Kvi4JPUsak

Re: B-trees in Factorio

#53

Post by cedws »

dragontamer wrote: post #7

An inefficient design, but computer-science theory in Factorio means playing suboptimally necessarily. (Factorio wasn't designed to show off B-Trees, all the tools were designed to ya know... play Factorio) ------------ So I have to comments. #1 is about the Comp-Sci side, and #2 is about the optimization side. #3 combines both together for what I'd like to talk about. 1. Self-balancing trees (2-3 trees, Red-black Tr…

I've been dreaming of coming up a kind of 'ultimate' design by generating an expandable factory blueprint based on a set of guaranteed resource inputs, ensuring 100% utilisation of every machine and making output (rockets) at a predictable rate. Such a design would be complicated by speed/productivity upgrades that you get as you progress.

Re: B-trees in Factorio

#54

Post by h2odragon »

willis936 wrote: post #45
DonHopkins wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm at 6,251.5 but I leave it running all night long. I used to play Factorio. I still do, but I used to, too. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqHA5CIL0fg

I remember this guy on Comedy Central growing up. I never knew he died in 2005. Sucks.

I missed his entire career. head down working no time for TV, people said "you should check this guy out" and a few years later he wasnt there no more.

Re: B-trees in Factorio

#55

Post by jon-wood »

Why did someone have to go and post Factorio content here? Now I’ve got the urge to sink another hundred hours or so into it when there are already way too many good games to play this year.

Re: B-trees in Factorio

#56

Post by hospitalJail »

dragontamer wrote: post #7

An inefficient design, but computer-science theory in Factorio means playing suboptimally necessarily. (Factorio wasn't designed to show off B-Trees, all the tools were designed to ya know... play Factorio) ------------ So I have to comments. #1 is about the Comp-Sci side, and #2 is about the optimization side. #3 combines both together for what I'd like to talk about. 1. Self-balancing trees (2-3 trees, Red-black Tr…

This is why I don't play factorio. That brainpower can be used towards humanity and you get sick social media likes when you show off your results.

Video games that ask me to provide brainpower in return for numbers on a screen are bottom of my list. I want to learn something new.

Sure there might be puzzle aspects, and yes we decide that it is fun... but can't you also decide your studies are fun too?

Re: B-trees in Factorio

#58

Post by munchbunny »

araes wrote: post #26
dragontamer wrote: post #7

An inefficient design, but computer-science theory in Factorio means playing suboptimally necessarily. (Factorio wasn't designed to show off B-Trees, all the tools were designed to ya know... play Factorio) ------------ So I have to comments. #1 is about the Comp-Sci side, and #2 is about the optimization side. #3 combines both together for what I'd like to talk about. 1. Self-balancing trees (2-3 trees, Red-black Tr…

Superficially examining the Clos Network article, if Factorio is amenable to creating such networks, then it seems like it would be possible to create some of the simpler neural network designs, such as shown here: [1] Maybe having something like a weighting of the resource density arriving at a certain location to change the output? From the mechanics I can see here [2] it looks like Mergers / Un-Mergers and three b…

Factorio's "circuits" mechanic could implement neural networks pretty directly since the components can do 32-bit logic and arithmetic (integer only). It'd be pretty straightforward to implement a multi-layered neural network with a ReLU activation function.

Re: B-trees in Factorio

#59

Post by BlueTemplar »

Qwertious wrote: post #47
dragontamer wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no "metagame" in Factorio because its not a PvP game. The "metagame" in Magic the Gathering or Starcraft revolves around the game before the game is played. For example, if I see that my opponent in Starcraft is a Terrain player (and I'm a Zerg player), I can study their games and see that they prefer to open 8-rax 3 marines very early harassments. I then decide to practice 9-pool / 6-ling and make sure I'm g…

I'm gonna disagree with you - accepting your definitions, Factorio has both a meta and a metagame. Because co-op can have a metagame, except instead of needing to know what your opponent will do in order to best hinder them, you need to know what your friend will do in order to best help them. Point in case: try joining a deathworld server (with experienced players), and then spamming burner miners. Once you're immed…

That's still game, not metagame : burner miners are bad because polluting, that's just game knowledge, you would have trouble if you tried to do that yourself in your own Death World game.

But great point, co-op might require modifying your tactics to better work with teammates - in case of Factorio I know that you have to be WAY more careful to not make spaghetti in MP, which might also depend on the familiarity between the players - so I would say that you can potentially have a metagame as soon as you have MP, even without PvP.

But now that I think of it, you can potentially have a metagame even when playing against AI. It's just that it needs to be advanced enough to be able to play rock/paper/scissors and remember previous games against you. AFAIK these games exist, but because it's much less effort and better reward to support basic AI + MP, they tend to be vanishingly rare, especially for more complex games.

Re: B-trees in Factorio

#60

Post by araes »

munchbunny wrote: post #58
araes wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Superficially examining the Clos Network article, if Factorio is amenable to creating such networks, then it seems like it would be possible to create some of the simpler neural network designs, such as shown here: [1] Maybe having something like a weighting of the resource density arriving at a certain location to change the output? From the mechanics I can see here [2] it looks like Mergers / Un-Mergers and three b…

Factorio's "circuits" mechanic could implement neural networks pretty directly since the components can do 32-bit logic and arithmetic (integer only). It'd be pretty straightforward to implement a multi-layered neural network with a ReLU activation function.

Agree. Just based on the previous comments, it sounded like the goals was a "belt only" type of design. Figured there might be interesting functionality with variable belt object density arriving at a location being a determinant.
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