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BMW's Ultimate Driving Machine, for Driving Through Gunfire and Grenades

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Re: BMW's Ultimate Driving Machine, for Driving Through Gunfire and Grenades

#51

Post by maximinus_thrax »

some_random wrote: post #41
maximinus_thrax wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Spot on. Musk is doing it with the cybertruck as well. It's a dog whistle for the rich being mindful about the unwashed masses finally picking up pitchforks.

I cannot stress this enough, a $60k or so electric truck has nothing in common with an uparmored billionaire-mobile.

You should probably stress it even more, or have Tesla change their product description:

> Cybertruck is built with an exterior shell made for ultimate durability and *passenger protection*. Starting with a *nearly impenetrable exoskeleton*, every component is designed for superior strength and endurance, from *Ultra-Hard 30X Cold-Rolled stainless-steel structural skin* to Tesla *armor glass*.

> If there was something better, we’d use it. Help eliminate dents, damage and long-term corrosion with a smooth monochrome exoskeleton that puts the shell on the outside of the car and *provides you and your passengers maximum protection*

> Ultra-strong glass and polymer-layered composite can *absorb and redirect impact force* for improved performance and damage tolerance.

Fine, I agree to some extent. This is not a billionaire-mobile. It's a paranoid-aspiring-billionaire-mobile.

I only hope I have enough money to get this and be protected when the plebs start throwing shit at my car.

Re: BMW's Ultimate Driving Machine, for Driving Through Gunfire and Grenades

#52

Post by some_random »

maximinus_thrax wrote: post #51
some_random wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I cannot stress this enough, a $60k or so electric truck has nothing in common with an uparmored billionaire-mobile.

You should probably stress it even more, or have Tesla change their product description: > Cybertruck is built with an exterior shell made for ultimate durability and *passenger protection*. Starting with a *nearly impenetrable exoskeleton*, every component is designed for superior strength and endurance, from *Ultra-Hard 30X Cold-Rolled stainless-steel structural skin* to Tesla *armor glass*. > If there was somethin…

For starters, Elon has made it very clear what the fantasy he's selling is; that of being a colonist on Mars. But more importantly, this truck is being sold as a work and adventure vehicle, that's why it's modeled with a tent and camping gear or a matching ATV. The emphasis on durability and shit is just Elon's weird idea of what a good rugged exploration vehicle would be.

Oh and finally, make no mistake the people who are driving a cybertruck are plebs. Anyone who doesn't have a professional driver and armed security is a pleb.

Re: BMW's Ultimate Driving Machine, for Driving Through Gunfire and Grenades

#53

Post by whimsicalism »

HeyLaughingBoy wrote: post #47
whimsicalism wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a scam because they likely were not planning on chopping down their trees anyways.

How is that a scam? You propose that if I don't do something, you will pay me because it benefits you in some way. I agree to not do that thing and happily walk away with the cash. Everybody gets what they want. Why does it matter whether or not I was planning to do the thing?

Because they are selling them as carbon credits in carbon markets for full price per ton of CO2 using fraudulent measures of how much carbon is additionally being averted (additionality). To be clear, the bad actors are those selling the credits claiming that these properties would have been chopped down otherwise (not the property owners).

Then actors like Apple, airlines, etc. get to claim they have fully offset their supply chain despite nothing of the sort occurring because of counterfeit carbon credits.

e: And fwiw, I have done analysis of this offline as part of a personal project - based on what I saw looking at global forestry data, the evidence is strong that the vast majority of REDD (deforestation) carbon credits are fraudulent IMO - areas being sold at the cost of carbon if the whole plot was cut down despite there being effectively no risk of that.

Re: BMW's Ultimate Driving Machine, for Driving Through Gunfire and Grenades

#54

Post by ipython »

foxtrottbravo wrote: post #12

Interesting read on the BMW 7 series Protection vehicle. Here's a tidbit from the field: I've heard, through the grapevine, about a team responsible for the safety of a certain high-profile individual (no names mentioned, of course ). About a year ago, they made a strategic shift away from BMWs as protection vehicles. Why? Because in emergency escape scenarios, it's crucial to be able to move the car even with the do…

There are other 'convenience' features that become problematic in a highly adversarial environment, such as unlocking all the doors when you shift into park, or unlocking the doors and shutting off the fuel supply when an accident is detected. In an emergency situation you may have to ram through a vehicle blockade- I would hate for the car to then suddenly shut down in that case...

Re: BMW's Ultimate Driving Machine, for Driving Through Gunfire and Grenades

#56

Post by netsharc »

HeyLaughingBoy wrote: post #47
whimsicalism wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a scam because they likely were not planning on chopping down their trees anyways.

How is that a scam? You propose that if I don't do something, you will pay me because it benefits you in some way. I agree to not do that thing and happily walk away with the cash. Everybody gets what they want. Why does it matter whether or not I was planning to do the thing?

Flawed analogy time:

Ad: "Help thirsty kids in Africa!"

Reality: the kids get 100 liters of water a month from a river (yeah not enough).

You: pay a contribution hoping to get them more water.

The "offset" sellers: "See those 100 liters? 5 of them are now being paid by HeyLaughingBoy. He's helping!".

The carbon was being pulled from the air anyway, but paying gives you a certificate to say your money did that. Meanwhile the net CO2 output hasn't changed up nor down. Or rather up because you're consuming something that output CO2 to make. (Philosophical argument, the product would have already been made before your purchase, unless it's something bespoke...)

Re: BMW's Ultimate Driving Machine, for Driving Through Gunfire and Grenades

#57

Post by tim333 »

AustinDev wrote: post #31

I just want the gun youtubers to pool their funds to buy one and test it out. I'm curious how it does against tungsten cored rounds of various calibers such as 5.56, .308, .338 and maybe some .50 BMG.

Apparently the glass is VPAM 10 rated. Here's a list of weapons for different ratings https://www.aurum-security.de/en/standards/protection-levels...

Re: BMW's Ultimate Driving Machine, for Driving Through Gunfire and Grenades

#58

Post by maximinus_thrax »

some_random wrote: post #52
maximinus_thrax wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should probably stress it even more, or have Tesla change their product description: > Cybertruck is built with an exterior shell made for ultimate durability and *passenger protection*. Starting with a *nearly impenetrable exoskeleton*, every component is designed for superior strength and endurance, from *Ultra-Hard 30X Cold-Rolled stainless-steel structural skin* to Tesla *armor glass*. > If there was somethin…

For starters, Elon has made it very clear what the fantasy he's selling is; that of being a colonist on Mars. But more importantly, this truck is being sold as a work and adventure vehicle, that's why it's modeled with a tent and camping gear or a matching ATV. The emphasis on durability and shit is just Elon's weird idea of what a good rugged exploration vehicle would be. Oh and finally, make no mistake the people w…

> Elon has made it very clear what the fantasy he's selling is

Please read my original comment again, emphasis on the 'dog whistle'

> Oh and finally, make no mistake the people who are driving a cybertruck are plebs. Anyone who doesn't have a professional driver and armed security is a pleb.

Please read my last comment again, emphasis on the 'aspiring'. And there are different classes of plebs. Plebs who can afford a 60k truck != plebs who live in their cars.

Re: BMW's Ultimate Driving Machine, for Driving Through Gunfire and Grenades

#59

Post by toss1 »

foxtrottbravo wrote: post #18
toss1 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Excess is relative. When you have $$billions, $150K extra to have your custom protection vehicle at the venue is no big deal. And, are they even rentable in all locales, and do you trust those suppliers?

I am with you - while this might seem excessive there are enough people that have the cash and the threat model to go with it. From what I could find the 2009 Protection version (then called high security) was more around 400k-450k€. A standard model 7 runs from ~115k up to ~145k€.

Yes, I must say that I love BMW's approach. Everyone else just takes a frame and hangs off of it all the protection — just a massive increase in redundant weight and decrease in performance.

Far better to take BMW's approach, upgrade the materials so that the protection is structural; each component serves both purposes.

Re: BMW's Ultimate Driving Machine, for Driving Through Gunfire and Grenades

#60

Post by AustinDev »

tim333 wrote: post #57
AustinDev wrote: post #31

I just want the gun youtubers to pool their funds to buy one and test it out. I'm curious how it does against tungsten cored rounds of various calibers such as 5.56, .308, .338 and maybe some .50 BMG.

Apparently the glass is VPAM 10 rated. Here's a list of weapons for different ratings https://www.aurum-security.de/en/standards/protection-levels...

7.62x54R is a pretty impressive round to be stopping with glass. I’m honestly pretty damn impressed.
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