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The rise of the open kitchen

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Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#51

Post by balfirevic »

Swizec wrote: post #29
osigurdson wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think detached houses with yards are better.

Nah detached houses with yards are the worst of both worlds. You get neither the easily accessible town/city experience nor enough land to do anything interesting with. But I’m probably biased because I grew up in a city and regularly visited grandparents with legit farms. If you’re gonna have land, it should support at least a decent-sized garden … maybe a few fruit trees, nice shed, couple chickens. You definitely…

> You definitely don’t want a yard that’s spitting distance to your neighbors’ house, that’s just silly.

I don't care about having land (nor yard - I especially don't want to take care of one), but detached house is the only way to have loud and/or space intensive hobbies (playing music with drums, karaoke, machine shop). Invent magic sound-isolating material and I'd prefer large flats in buildings, for easy access to everything.

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#52

Post by Swizec »

balfirevic wrote: post #51
Swizec wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nah detached houses with yards are the worst of both worlds. You get neither the easily accessible town/city experience nor enough land to do anything interesting with. But I’m probably biased because I grew up in a city and regularly visited grandparents with legit farms. If you’re gonna have land, it should support at least a decent-sized garden … maybe a few fruit trees, nice shed, couple chickens. You definitely…

> You definitely don’t want a yard that’s spitting distance to your neighbors’ house, that’s just silly. I don't care about having land (nor yard - I especially don't want to take care of one), but detached house is the only way to have loud and/or space intensive hobbies (playing music with drums, karaoke, machine shop). Invent magic sound-isolating material and I'd prefer large flats in buildings, for easy access t…

Modern buildings can be surprisingly sound proof. I’ve seen apartments where you close the window overlooking a busy street at rush hour and it’s complete silence inside.

And I’ve lived in detached suburban houses where you can hear your neighbors sneeze.

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#53

Post by balfirevic »

Swizec wrote: post #52
balfirevic wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You definitely don’t want a yard that’s spitting distance to your neighbors’ house, that’s just silly. I don't care about having land (nor yard - I especially don't want to take care of one), but detached house is the only way to have loud and/or space intensive hobbies (playing music with drums, karaoke, machine shop). Invent magic sound-isolating material and I'd prefer large flats in buildings, for easy access t…

Modern buildings can be surprisingly sound proof. I’ve seen apartments where you close the window overlooking a busy street at rush hour and it’s complete silence inside. And I’ve lived in detached suburban houses where you can hear your neighbors sneeze.

> I’ve seen apartments where you close the window overlooking a busy street at rush hour and it’s complete silence inside.

That seems much easier than the examples I mentioned. I would like you to be right though, and if you are - that it was more common.

> And I’ve lived in detached suburban houses where you can hear your neighbors sneeze.

True, but at least you have some control over soundproofing if you own the entire thing and if that's something you care about.

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#54

Post by osigurdson »

Swizec wrote: post #52
balfirevic wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You definitely don’t want a yard that’s spitting distance to your neighbors’ house, that’s just silly. I don't care about having land (nor yard - I especially don't want to take care of one), but detached house is the only way to have loud and/or space intensive hobbies (playing music with drums, karaoke, machine shop). Invent magic sound-isolating material and I'd prefer large flats in buildings, for easy access t…

Modern buildings can be surprisingly sound proof. I’ve seen apartments where you close the window overlooking a busy street at rush hour and it’s complete silence inside. And I’ve lived in detached suburban houses where you can hear your neighbors sneeze.

So we are comparing modern sound proofed multi-tenant buildings to non-modern, non-soundproofed suburban houses? Or are you saying that a suburban house cannot be built with sound proofing?

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#55

Post by Swizec »

osigurdson wrote: post #54
Swizec wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Modern buildings can be surprisingly sound proof. I’ve seen apartments where you close the window overlooking a busy street at rush hour and it’s complete silence inside. And I’ve lived in detached suburban houses where you can hear your neighbors sneeze.

So we are comparing modern sound proofed multi-tenant buildings to non-modern, non-soundproofed suburban houses? Or are you saying that a suburban house cannot be built with sound proofing?

I’m saying it is not a given that apartments are noisy and it’s not a given that houses are quiet. As you say, it depends on soundproofing not on the form of housing.

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#56

Post by randomdata »

toyg wrote: post #49
randomdata wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The cooking is still exclusively done by "the help" in restaurants, but the article indicates that the theatre, so to speak, of food preparation has come to be considered a desirable trait by those occupying the dining room. So this doesn't quite answer why they settled on keeping it hidden instead of a display of entertainment. There is no reason to think people in that time wouldn't have found the same enjoyment in…

> it's just what one notable person happened to decide Oh no. Chances are the real engine of this change is the recent mass-media discovery of food-prep as a heroic and cool activity. Celebrity chefs used to be obnoxious, "always-be-prepared", by-the-book home-goddess archetypes like Delia Smith; at some point over the last 25 years, they turned into sexy, improvising, creative rockstars. The creativity-impoverished…

You are quite right that another notable person came along and, to buck the trend, decided it would be entertaining to watch "the help", and then the rest started to follow thinking that must be what is required to become notable.

But it could have gone the other way. The first notable person could have recognized the entertainment, and the later notable person could have decided it was better to keep hidden. We don't know why the first one decided to go with hidden, and likely it was just a random choice.

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#57

Post by pseudalopex »

prawn wrote: post #36
lc9er wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My take is the opposite. It’s a nightmare of noise, where everyone is forced to be louder than everyone else. Anyone trying to read or do homework is forced to flee to the edges of the house to find an escape.

Don't people wanting to read in peace just do it in their room? There are social activities in the open plan area (cooking together, painting, crafting, etc) and then anyone working or reading is often doing it in their room or the home office.

Many people enjoy quiet activities together. Or work better when another works near.

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#58

Post by prawn »

pseudalopex wrote: post #57
prawn wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't people wanting to read in peace just do it in their room? There are social activities in the open plan area (cooking together, painting, crafting, etc) and then anyone working or reading is often doing it in their room or the home office.

Many people enjoy quiet activities together. Or work better when another works near.

If the majority wanted quiet, couldn't they easily push the person wanting to listen to music or watch TV into their room? We have five people in our house; if someone wants to watch something solo, they're usually watching it on an iPad in their room or at the other end of the house.

Open plan living plus individual bedrooms and things like den/study/second lounge, etc gives flexibility.

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#59

Post by WirelessGigabit »

sdm wrote: post #21
faitswulff wrote: post #2

I was hoping this was going to talk about the increasingly trendy open kitchen concept in homes, or more specifically answer the question: why have kitchens traditionally been separated from dining areas in the first place? Unfortunately, the article is about restaurants.

> why have kitchens traditionally been separated from dining areas in the first place? Smell. To keep the smells of cooking from overwhelming the rest of the house. In the process of building a new house and it will be a separate kitchen. Well, technically, a wet kitchen that is closed off and a small dry kitchen connected to the dining area for dealing with things that aren't strong smelling. This setup is pretty st…

Having lived in multiple apartments and now back into a house I am amazed that US apartments (at least the ones where I lived) did not have a range hood that blew stuff to the outside. All they did was recirculate air through a grease filter. In other words, useless.

Now back in a house with a connection to the outside. Actually does something.

Although I try to cook outside, because cooking inside means I have to pay for more AC.

Re: The rise of the open kitchen

#60

Post by pseudalopex »

prawn wrote: post #58
pseudalopex wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many people enjoy quiet activities together. Or work better when another works near.

If the majority wanted quiet, couldn't they easily push the person wanting to listen to music or watch TV into their room? We have five people in our house; if someone wants to watch something solo, they're usually watching it on an iPad in their room or at the other end of the house. Open plan living plus individual bedrooms and things like den/study/second lounge, etc gives flexibility.

Did you forget the discussion was about kitchens? And many people's homes do not have all individual bedrooms and things like den/study/second lounge. The advantages and disadvantages of open plan suit your preferences. Your preferences are not universal.
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