Majority of EU countries support scanning of audio communications • Hacker News Board

Re: Majority of EU countries support scanning of audio communications

#51

Post by antiloper » Wed, May 17, 2023, 10:34 AM UTC

bjoli wrote: post #16

nforgerit wrote: post #13

I used to be a convinced pro-European but for me it's getting harder and harder to _not_ believe in some kind of plot for assuming total control over their citizens. Each and every EU regulation concerning "things digital" is pointing to a direction where "freedom" is just an empty buzzword used for virtue signalling against states like China. I am getting seriously concerned about things (not that i haven't been bef…

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It is not "exclusively the right". The social democrats strongly voted in favour of chatcontrol. If there's anything all EU bureaucrats are agreeing on, it's that they need more power.

https://mepwatch.eu/9/vote.html?v=134463

Re: Majority of EU countries support scanning of audio communications

#52

Post by soco » Wed, May 17, 2023, 2:07 PM UTC

Yujf wrote: post #17

nforgerit wrote: post #13

I used to be a convinced pro-European but for me it's getting harder and harder to _not_ believe in some kind of plot for assuming total control over their citizens. Each and every EU regulation concerning "things digital" is pointing to a direction where "freedom" is just an empty buzzword used for virtue signalling against states like China. I am getting seriously concerned about things (not that i haven't been bef…

It is a difficult thing. Because of it's size, the EU often feels unnaccountable to me. Also the news does not focus on who votes for what or what their ideas in the EU are but only focusses on national level. And then the EU makes decisions that I dissagree with and it leaves a bad taste. On the other hand, I believe the EU has so much potential and is a huge benefit overall

I would say it is accountable buuuttt ssoooooo sssllooowwwwww that in the end it almost feels unaccountable, and that's a pity. I don't know though how to bring together so many directions and so many (levels of) legislators in a quicker manner... and let's face it, the EU voters aren't smarter or better informed than in other places.

Re: Majority of EU countries support scanning of audio communications

#53

Post by raxxorraxor » Wed, May 17, 2023, 3:07 PM UTC

nforgerit wrote: post #13

I used to be a convinced pro-European but for me it's getting harder and harder to _not_ believe in some kind of plot for assuming total control over their citizens. Each and every EU regulation concerning "things digital" is pointing to a direction where "freedom" is just an empty buzzword used for virtue signalling against states like China. I am getting seriously concerned about things (not that i haven't been bef…

It isn't a plot, it is a bureaucracy. And old and a scared one.

I too went from pro-European to being mostly critical of it. That was years ago though. Some parts do good work, but these attempts are just overreaching.

The EU is no federation and it shouldn't be one. It would be governed by people like this that have basically no accountability. You can argue that it is just the governments of member states, but that doesn't make it any better. The vast majority are not accountable to you in any case.

Of course the EU has a democratic deficit. Although even wikipedia articles about that are already full of propaganda.

Best solution to the current dilemma is to put up technical realities that make such attempts unfeasible.

Re: Majority of EU countries support scanning of audio communications

#54

Post by raxxorraxor » Wed, May 17, 2023, 3:14 PM UTC

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #10

This is a terrible headline. It gives impression that the majority of electorate supports this. Or maybe majority of their respective parliaments does. But it's just the executive branch of the EU itself- "A majority of the EU Council of Ministers". More or less, each government selects a minister to represent them in this council. The article should really be reporting on how this bill is progressing. I am no legal…

Well these are ministers for interior matters. Probably one of the worst government jobs and maybe the only one where you could excuse them having a pro-surveillance position or arguing for something like that by default.

Well, someone has to take that job. But they shouldn't be listend to and I think these ambitions are clearly in violation of multiple constitutions. Although those that have exemptions for security are more or less worthless anyway.

Re: Majority of EU countries support scanning of audio communications

#55

Post by bjoli » Wed, May 17, 2023, 9:09 PM UTC

antiloper wrote: post #51

bjoli wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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It is not "exclusively the right". The social democrats strongly voted in favour of chatcontrol. If there's anything all EU bureaucrats are agreeing on, it's that they need more power. https://mepwatch.eu/9/vote.html?v=134463

European social democracy hasn't been left in some time apart for maybe in words.

Regarding EU votes it is fun to always see the same division: people from countries where there is still a left phalanx of the social democratic party always seem to have people (who are always the same) voting with GUE/NGL.