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Anxious dogs, like anxious people, need help managing and reducing distress

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Re: Anxious dogs, like anxious people, need help managing and reducing distress

#51

Post by asdfman123 »

misja111 wrote: post #18

I love dogs, but aren't there bigger issues in this world that we should focus on first? Millions of children on this planet are malnourished or suffering because of wars, climate change or just bad government. Is it ethical to pay a fortune for magnetic brain stimulation of your dog, if somewhere else in the world several people's lives could be saved with that money?

Not directly related to your comment, but:

I’ve always been weirdly frugal and I think this is the real reason that I don’t admit. Seems unfair to spend a lot of money on anything.

I would say that any kind of expense beyond what you’d pay as a poor college student would fall into this category, though, if you want to be consistent.

I’m not however donating much, though. My plan is to build a pile and donate it when I pass.

Re: Anxious dogs, like anxious people, need help managing and reducing distress

#52

Post by FooBarBizBazz »

sidewndr46 wrote: post #34
mikepurvis wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a parent who has had to do a bunch of this work, I think a big missing piece in much of the dialogue around it is understanding how exactly the “gentle” style of engagement isn’t just indulging, tolerating, excusing, and even rewarding bad behaviour. The official word is that adopting a gentle and emotionally aware stance has to be paired with a strong sense of boundaries, but it’s often very unclear how to differ…

The idea that asking someone how they are feeling is an "emotional deep dive" is a portion of the problem. Asking a family member how they are feeling should not be considered an in-depth activity.

It's something for a trained professional to do, see...

Re: Anxious dogs, like anxious people, need help managing and reducing distress

#53

Post by FooBarBizBazz »

the_third_wave wrote: post #49
bloopernova wrote: post #6

I wonder if this differs from wolves? I sometimes think about just how much we have evolved dogs to mirror us in so many different ways. In other words: by selecting for responsiveness to human emotions, to what degree have we made dogs' brains more like our own? Now I'm going to cuddle my pup Henry.

> Now I'm going to cuddle my pup Henry. If you're American there is a big chance that you're using the word pup for a dog of any age. This in itself is a tell-tale sign of the way many people - especially those who are wont to write or speak about their dogs in public places - think about them, as permanent juveniles who will never "grow up".

> permanent juveniles who will never "grow up".

The removal of testes/ovaries before puberty has something to do with that.

Go to the third world and look at the dogs in the street. They have teats for nursing puppies and balls for making them, all plain as day. What dogs look like in developed countries isn't natural.

Re: Anxious dogs, like anxious people, need help managing and reducing distress

#55

Post by XCSme »

screye wrote: post #47
bradleyjg wrote: post #20

Is there a direct connection between falling birth rates and treating animals as if they were beloved children? It seems like these animals evolutionary strategy is akin to that of the cuckoo bird.

Don't know why you're downvoted. Most Americans seems to put in more effort into their dogs, than people used to with their children 100 years ago. Take care of your kid like you'd a long-lived dog, and that's enough attention for long enough. By the end of it, the kid has grown into an adult. The problem is that parents are expected to parent too much. American car centric infrastructure affects this a lot. But, lat…

Haven't pets, especially dogs, been treated as part of the family for a really long time (thousands of years)?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_depictions_of_dogs

Re: Anxious dogs, like anxious people, need help managing and reducing distress

#56

Post by pfannkuchen »

bradleyjg wrote: post #20

Is there a direct connection between falling birth rates and treating animals as if they were beloved children? It seems like these animals evolutionary strategy is akin to that of the cuckoo bird.

It seems like they are like Tylenol for the child nurturing instinct. It doesn’t get rid of it completely but you can get on with your day.

Re: Anxious dogs, like anxious people, need help managing and reducing distress

#57

Post by bloopernova »

the_third_wave wrote: post #49
bloopernova wrote: post #6

I wonder if this differs from wolves? I sometimes think about just how much we have evolved dogs to mirror us in so many different ways. In other words: by selecting for responsiveness to human emotions, to what degree have we made dogs' brains more like our own? Now I'm going to cuddle my pup Henry.

> Now I'm going to cuddle my pup Henry. If you're American there is a big chance that you're using the word pup for a dog of any age. This in itself is a tell-tale sign of the way many people - especially those who are wont to write or speak about their dogs in public places - think about them, as permanent juveniles who will never "grow up".

He's 11 months old tomorrow. I guess I could have said "young dog" instead.

As for "pup" think of it like a term of endearment similar to sweetie, babe, honey, etc etc.

Re: Anxious dogs, like anxious people, need help managing and reducing distress

#58

Post by pfannkuchen »

rowanG077 wrote: post #38
rhacker wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If everyone that read your comment decided to donate, it might.

No chance. Donating is not a solution to world hunger.

It could be if the money goes towards helping to build food production systems as opposed to buying food. I wonder if charities do this? Buying food just kicks the can down the road for sure.

Re: Anxious dogs, like anxious people, need help managing and reducing distress

#59

Post by mikepurvis »

kevviiinn wrote: post #32
mikepurvis wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a parent who has had to do a bunch of this work, I think a big missing piece in much of the dialogue around it is understanding how exactly the “gentle” style of engagement isn’t just indulging, tolerating, excusing, and even rewarding bad behaviour. The official word is that adopting a gentle and emotionally aware stance has to be paired with a strong sense of boundaries, but it’s often very unclear how to differ…

I think what the OP was getting at is perfectly exemplified in this comment. A person who is set in their ways and unable to comprehend the emotional state of another being, just viewing the resulting behaviors as purely "bad"

At risk of attacking a straw man, do you believe it's ever possible to have a "bad" behaviour? When an adult throws a temper tantrum to an airplane stewardess, is that also something we should look on with "comprehension of another being's emotional state", or is it in fact entitlement, selfishness, poor regulation, and unrealistic expectations? Is that behaviour something we can agree on as being "bad"?

I think that some of this debate comes down to what the ultimate purpose of parenting is— is it to be an eternal safe space for our kids? Somewhere that they can always feel understood and welcomed and heard, where they'll never be asked to consider if their feelings reflect an accurate perception of the world, whether their attitudes have shaped how they experience certain situations, or if their own words and actions have helped create a circumstance they're now frustrated by? Or is parenting about preparing kids to ultimately become citizens of the real world, where teachers, colleagues, bosses, neighbours, doctors, police, airline staff and others will require a certain standard of behaviour and will have basically zero interest in whatever your "reasons" are for why that standard cannot be met at a particular moment.

In truth, the answer is somewhere in the middle. The best parents can both be that safe and listening space, while also gently challenging us to grow and do better (yes, even into adulthood). But I don't see a lot of that nuance from many gentle parenting advocates, who sound much more hard-line, casting non-believers as being "set in their ways", and often responding pretty negatively to parents' fatigue with the extremely exhausting work that it can be constantly taking on and processing the emotions of everyone around them.

On the other hand, there are now a bunch of voices calling for a more balanced approach than what one might find on Instagram and Tiktok:

- https://mashable.com/article/gentle-parenting-social-media-p...

- https://www.parents.com/parenting/better-parenting/style/gen...

- https://filterfreeparents.com/gentle-parenting-is-physically...

- https://www.nytimes.com/2023/05/13/style/millennial-earnest-...

Re: Anxious dogs, like anxious people, need help managing and reducing distress

#60

Post by bityard »

pfannkuchen wrote: post #58
rowanG077 wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No chance. Donating is not a solution to world hunger.

It could be if the money goes towards helping to build food production systems as opposed to buying food. I wonder if charities do this? Buying food just kicks the can down the road for sure.

That won't help either. The problem in those areas is local and national corruption. If you bring farming equipment into an impoverished third-world community and teach them how to use it, the local warlord/drug gang just comes in after you've left and steals or destroys the farming equipment.

It's an unfortunate fact of reality that foreign aid, though very well-intentioned, benefits the rulers and generals of corrupt governments more than it benefits their citizens. See "The Dictator's Handbook" by Mesquita and Smith.

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