April fool?
Though the same. Too ridiculous to be true.
Italian government seeks to penalize the use of English words
51–60 of 605 posts
Re: Italian government seeks to penalize the use of English words
#52The current Italian government has introduced the "ministry of industry and made in Italy". That's what's it called, made in Italy , in English in the official name. I guess they're going to fine themselves.
Your not kidding:
Re: Italian government seeks to penalize the use of English words
#53Good. Americans are usually not aware of the extent of american cultural imperialism which is basically everywhere, not just in Europe but you can see it very strong here I'm not saying it's bad or good. But I wish we have less Hollywood, less Netflix, less american music, less american videogames, less imported american culture topics etc when actual local music, movies, books, games exist.
Shouldn't the onus be on local music/movies/books to compete on their own merits?
If you go to Brazil, for example, there's zero worry about American music. Brazilian music holds its own, and then some. If you go to India, their domestic cinema is obviously thriving.
Nobody's "pushing" American media on consumers around the world. Cultural imperialism is ultimately a false narrative -- consumers pick the things they like, as they should because that's their free choice. Switching the TV channel or the radio dial is the easiest thing ever.
Re: Italian government seeks to penalize the use of English words
#54I think we (Americans and Europeans alike) wholly underestimate how Americanised European culture is becoming. This is an observation rather than a criticism as I don't know whether this is 'good' or 'bad' but it is noticeable phenomena manifest through language, and probably an unintended consequence of the dependency of Europe on US communication technology, leading to the import of US communication styles, politic…
Yeah, it was shocking here in Stockholm when there were BLM protests in 2020. It's like people are more involved in US politics than their national politics.
Racism is at least as prevalent - and far more out-in-the-open - in Europe than in the US. There should be BLM or equivalent protests all over Europe, frankly. It's shocking how openly racist Europeans are (whether eg Italians about Africans, Germans about anyone, or Europeans routinely about gypsies).
Ever gone on Reddit and looked at what Swedes say about refugees and immigrants (post ~2014 or so; in 2015 they were burning refugee camps)? The racist, anti-non-Swede, nationalism type is only going to get a lot worse there. The integration of refugees into Swedish society has been a complete failure, which you can see in the crime and employment outcomes. If it were the US, the blame would be squarely placed on racist behavior / dominant culture preventing the refugees from thriving.
Re: Italian government seeks to penalize the use of English words
#55Trying to prevent some sort of western style gentrification? How come japan doesn’t have this problem?
I don't consider it a problem, language alone is an extremely superficial indicator of culture - see my other comment. But japan is a good example- maybe that's what you're driving at - because the language is full of english loan words. That's a big part of what the katakana characters are for - fitting predominantly English words into the japanese syllables. トイレ ミーティング ダンス パーティ フライドポテト Etc. As you say, it doesn't i…
I worked on the Metal Gear Solid from PS1 to PC. This was back in 2000, and my first real gamedev job. Fresh from Bulgaria, haven't played any consoles, and just using a WordStar program I've exracted all japanese comments from the source code, "translated" them - well word by word I think with the WordStar (I don't recall the exact name) then put them back. Some things were just too funny...
At the point where the game was supposed to handle CONTINUE, the comment was CONTINEKU. Another one was METARU GERU SORIDU (or GIRU, don't remember). and more than that... all in all though even with word-by-word translation I was able to get through (we were only 3 "interns" working on the project + our boss (lead)).
Also learned how well "C" can be written :)
Re: Italian government seeks to penalize the use of English words
#56Earlier quoted context omitted.
It is a very poor argument and ignores the fact that the lives of people, institutions and countries are not just about (the very important) jobs and economics. I, who have lived in the United States for decades, cringe when English words are used instead of those of my native language to give a sense of respectability to those words. A global culture and a world homogenized in ways of living is a much less interesti…
Culture can still thrive without being nationalist or traditionalist or whatever you call it. What would people think if there was an american movement to stop using foreign loan words in English because they're diluting our culture? I live in Quebec, Canada, where there is extreme policing of the French language, including various unconstitutional legislation to "preserve" French (the Canadian constitution has an ov…
According to this comment, we should (just) accept that English, in a generation or two, will become some sort of world language with no interest in the preservation of other languages and cultures associated with those cultures.
This is a bit provocative, but while we are there, we could also tear down the Colosseum, the Forum too since it is all rubbish, and build instead offices, or residential communities because who cares about those old buildings and "nationalists" and "traditionalists" or "whatever you want to call it".
There is often this idea that if you do one thing, you cannot do another, like there is some trade-offs between the use of the local language on official documents and the management of museums. But most of the time, there are no trade-offs, and the two actions are independent.
>> "What would people think if there was an american movement to stop using foreign loan words in English because they're diluting our culture?"
I am generally in favor. I mean, better to hear "ham" than "proskiuto" anyway.
Re: Italian government seeks to penalize the use of English words
#57The current Italian government has introduced the "ministry of industry and made in Italy". That's what's it called, made in Italy , in English in the official name. I guess they're going to fine themselves.
"Fatto in Italia" would be just as good, but might not be as widely understood by non-Italian speakers.
Re: Italian government seeks to penalize the use of English words
#58As an Italian now living abroad, every time I go back I am horrified by the way Italians mis-use all sorts of English words in many contexts of life...
One example: "smart-working". At the beginning of the pandemic, when we all started to "work remotely" or "work from home", Italians decided to call it "Smart Working". The first time I heard this term from a relative I was very confused, I thought it was just young people trying to "be fancy" as usual, with their fancy english words, but no, it actually had become the official way to refer to "working from home"... people had it in their contracts.
IMO this usage of the English language doesn't benefit anybody. Italians are not getting any better at English in general, language purists keep getting angrier and it's just adding a lot of confusion.
Re: Italian government seeks to penalize the use of English words
#59I think we (Americans and Europeans alike) wholly underestimate how Americanised European culture is becoming. This is an observation rather than a criticism as I don't know whether this is 'good' or 'bad' but it is noticeable phenomena manifest through language, and probably an unintended consequence of the dependency of Europe on US communication technology, leading to the import of US communication styles, politic…
But “Italian nationalists” aren’t a thing. There have been Italian language wars in border regions but they fizzle once non-locals get involved. For example, South Tyrol has a large German speaking population. The Italian government has historically encouraged adoption of Italian. But South Tyrol has (had?) a large Sicilian population that supported the local German speakers.
Very interesting observation!
I think it's great if local languages and identifies can continue to thrive, but I don't think it can be said that Italian nationalism isn't a thing though - it has explicitly been a thing as the suppression of regional dialects and the 'making of Italians' was a stated objective of Italian nationalists immediately after the unification of Italy.
btw this does not make Italy exceptional in any way, the way modern 'nation states' were built followed exactly this pattern - suppression of regional languages - 'cultural genocide' - and the creation a new national identity to replace them
Re: Italian government seeks to penalize the use of English words
#60Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yeah, it was shocking here in Stockholm when there were BLM protests in 2020. It's like people are more involved in US politics than their national politics.
Racism is at least as prevalent - and far more out-in-the-open - in Europe than in the US. There should be BLM or equivalent protests all over Europe, frankly. It's shocking how openly racist Europeans are (whether eg Italians about Africans, Germans about anyone, or Europeans routinely about gypsies). Ever gone on Reddit and looked at what Swedes say about refugees and immigrants (post ~2014 or so; in 2015 they were…
Everytime I hear someone from my dear Bulgaria claiming pure aryan race, and I roll my eyes. Of all the countries in Europe we must be one of the most mixed (lol, for good reasons) - as we are one of the connection points between Europe & Asia... but no ... pure Bulgarian race.... WAT?! (Actually our (10%) predecessors came somewhere from Bactria in Afghanistan... so really...)