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It’s Not TV: The Spectacular Rise, Revolution, and Future of HBO

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Re: It’s Not TV: The Spectacular Rise, Revolution, and Future of HBO

#51

Post by [deleted] »

paxys wrote: post #23
game_the0ry wrote: post #3

I am a fan of hbo, and have been for a long time, but I do miss the adult content: sexo urbano, showgirls: glitz and angst, taxicab confessions, etc. I vote to bring that back.

It's mostly a generational gap. A lot of us grew up in an environment where it would be a national scandal and the FCC would open an investigation if someone said a bad word on TV. The main allure of the shows you mention was their taboo nature. Ask anyone under 30 today if they want the same, and they'll shrug and go "if it makes sense in the script, sure".

[deleted]

Re: It’s Not TV: The Spectacular Rise, Revolution, and Future of HBO

#52

Post by echelon »

majormajor wrote: post #45
echelon wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Twitter and Reddit have shown that the population doesn't care if porn is mixed in with everything else. It's fine, it's fun, and it's harmless. The American WASP prudishness needs to die. We love our violence in film and drama. We should love our sexuality too. Game of Thrones was better for it.

"WASP prudishness" doesn't explain why there's less "purely sexual" TV and film content now than in the 90s.

There was a ton of nudity in 80's movies.

The internet stole the show and actors started pushing back against it because it was still culturally taboo. Only now are we starting to see a big reversion and normalization of nudity in the arts.

Netflix and HBO are dialing up on nudity and sex. Millennials and Gen Z like it, and they have the metrics to show for it.

https://sea.mashable.com/culture/17369/heres-why-youve-been-...

Re: It’s Not TV: The Spectacular Rise, Revolution, and Future of HBO

#53

Post by majormajor »

echelon wrote: post #52
majormajor wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"WASP prudishness" doesn't explain why there's less "purely sexual" TV and film content now than in the 90s.

There was a ton of nudity in 80's movies. The internet stole the show and actors started pushing back against it because it was still culturally taboo. Only now are we starting to see a big reversion and normalization of nudity in the arts. Netflix and HBO are dialing up on nudity and sex. Millennials and Gen Z like it, and they have the metrics to show for it. https://sea.mashable.com/culture/17369/heres-why-youve-b…

80s, 90s, not sure we need to make a big difference there.

Since then I think what you're seeing is more of a fracturing than an overall increase or decrease in prudishness.

https://www.newyorker.com/culture/the-new-yorker-interview/t... This talks about the small-screen stuff (and indie film) and dicks like you link out; but also points out the shift in mainstream cinema.

There's no more dicks or even breasts in tentpole blockbusters or the increasingly-adult-embraced "kids" films than there used to be. Even your R-rated stuff tends to have less of the sort of "coincidental" not-central-to-the-plot sex scenes than you would've seen a few decades ago. But what's left blockbuster film has found a place in "prestige TV" and by being moved less front-and-center, take-the-family-to-the-theater, it's been able to be amplified since entertainment as a whole is more fractured and it's less one-size-fits-all.

Re: It’s Not TV: The Spectacular Rise, Revolution, and Future of HBO

#54

Post by searealist »

echelon wrote: post #50
searealist wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The parent comment originally advocated putting hardcore porn into all content, but was edited.

> The parent comment originally advocated putting hardcore porn into all content, but was edited. That's a mischaracterization if I've ever seen one. My comment was originally written as this: > Twitter and Reddit have shown that the population doesn't care if porn is mixed in with everything else. [Including hardcore porn.] It's fine, it's fun, and it's harmless. I originally stated that Twitter and Reddit include h…

> Twitter and Reddit have shown that the population doesn't care if porn is mixed in with everything else. [Including hardcore porn.] It's fine, it's fun, and it's harmless.

But "hardcore porn" was not an add on sentence, it was subject of first sentence.

I didn't "latch" onto anything. Your entire premise is that there should be more hardcore porn in content and anyone who disagrees must be some prudish WASP. I am not saying hardcore porn in itself is a fetish. I am saying wanting it to be a part of otherwise non-pornographic material is a fetish.

Re: It’s Not TV: The Spectacular Rise, Revolution, and Future of HBO

#55

Post by pcthrowaway »

majormajor wrote: post #43
barkerja wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t The Last of Us currently one of the most popular shows on television right now? Its live viewership has continued to grow with each episode. Episode 1: 0.588 million Episode 7: 1.083 million For comparison, House of the Dragon ended the season with 1.855 million. Source: https://www.forbes.com/sites/paultassi/2023/03/03/the-last-o... The ratings are also worth looking at: https://www.ratingraph.com/tv-shows/the…

Live viewership for everything is way down ("spread out" is probably much more accurate, there's just more options). The Sopranos started with 2+M 18-49 viewers per episode in season 1 and was doing 4+M by its second season, and then went up to 6-7 for a few. http://www.ratingsryan.com/2020/12/the-sopranos-hbo-ratings-... Looks like their newer shows do a lot of cumulative views over time with streaming, but a lot le…

Wait, so you're comparing live viewership today with live viewership when the Sopranos airs? Unless live viewership includes people who watch the episode within 2 weeks of airing, I don't see how this makes sense.

People watched the shows live 20 years ago because they usually didn't have another option. If they missed an episode, and weren't lucky enough to have a friend that taped it, it frequently meant they were just going to have to have a friend summarize it for them while they waited for the next one.

Re: It’s Not TV: The Spectacular Rise, Revolution, and Future of HBO

#56

Post by [deleted] »

ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #39
nottathrowaway3 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article talks about how great the HBO gritty depressing character dramas like The Wire , The Last of Us , etc., were. That kind of content was interesting and fresh in the 90s and 00s. Personally though, whose life is so great today that they need to escape by watching something depressing? Most people I know (and knew) were generally feeling beat down, afraid for the future, tired of not being able to say what t…

I suspect that fiction tends to be opposite of reality. In the 1950s and 1960s, even though the economy was doing great, there was a lot of darkness in the world. There was the cold war, which was terrifying (you kids think it’s bad now ?), we still had World War 2, Korea, and even World War 1 veterans around. We were still coming to grips with The Holocaust, and counterculture was just starting up with The Beats (no…

[deleted]

Re: It’s Not TV: The Spectacular Rise, Revolution, and Future of HBO

#57

Post by barkerja »

remote_phone wrote: post #46

HBO is the only streaming service I am willing to pay $15/month for. I feel like the quality of their shoes are better than any of the rest especially compared to Netflix. Netflix content is very hit or miss but the last bunch of shows and especially the movies were terrible.

TV+ is close and seems to be following the HBO model. At at a fraction of the cost (currently).

But I agree. HBO is one TV service I don't mind paying annually for.

Re: It’s Not TV: The Spectacular Rise, Revolution, and Future of HBO

#58

Post by fleddr »

bogomipz wrote: post #31
fleddr wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the 80s/90s, on Dutch TV we'd have daytime deodorant commercials on public channels featuring naked women applying the product. Wasn't even considered sexual content, and in no way shielded from kids either. The context isn't sexual, and it's a perfectly normal body part. The sexualization of the human body is nothing but a cultural invention.

I'm curious why and when did those go away exactly on Dutch TV?

I only have speculative answers on offer...

Somehow the sexual revolution of the 60s/70s running out of steam, and a correction taking place. A growing influence of American culture as well as Muslim immigrants, both more conservative. And perhaps feminism changing course.

Re: It’s Not TV: The Spectacular Rise, Revolution, and Future of HBO

#59

Post by stcroixx »

majormajor wrote: post #53
echelon wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was a ton of nudity in 80's movies. The internet stole the show and actors started pushing back against it because it was still culturally taboo. Only now are we starting to see a big reversion and normalization of nudity in the arts. Netflix and HBO are dialing up on nudity and sex. Millennials and Gen Z like it, and they have the metrics to show for it. https://sea.mashable.com/culture/17369/heres-why-youve-b…

80s, 90s, not sure we need to make a big difference there. Since then I think what you're seeing is more of a fracturing than an overall increase or decrease in prudishness. https://www.newyorker.com/culture/the-new-yorker-interview/t... This talks about the small-screen stuff (and indie film) and dicks like you link out; but also points out the shift in mainstream cinema. There's no more dicks or even breasts in ten…

I assume this is to sanitize the big blockbusters for the Chinese market.

Re: It’s Not TV: The Spectacular Rise, Revolution, and Future of HBO

#60

Post by bogomipz »

fleddr wrote: post #58
bogomipz wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious why and when did those go away exactly on Dutch TV?

I only have speculative answers on offer... Somehow the sexual revolution of the 60s/70s running out of steam, and a correction taking place. A growing influence of American culture as well as Muslim immigrants, both more conservative. And perhaps feminism changing course.

Interesting. I think those are all very plausible and yet oddly we also now live in a hyper-sexualized mainstream advertising culture in the West.
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