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Fun with Gentoo: Why don't we just shuffle those ROP gadgets away?

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Re: Fun with Gentoo: Why don't we just shuffle those ROP gadgets away?

#51

I remember my Gentoo days freshman year in college. I spent more time compiling updates than actually using the computer.

College was some good distcc days though. My off campus house all ran Linux and they were dumb enough to distcc me. Debian, RedHat 9 (non rhel), and Slack were the other popular distros at the time. My school was ran on Solaris.

Re: Fun with Gentoo: Why don't we just shuffle those ROP gadgets away?

#52

I remember my Gentoo days freshman year in college. I spent more time compiling updates than actually using the computer.

I still use it and love it. On an i9-13900k, my Kconfig compiles in 1 minute[0] with -j33 and makes barely any noise or heat.

[0] https://www.dropbox.com/s/w1zlftin1cojkhr/kernel_compile.mov...

Re: Fun with Gentoo: Why don't we just shuffle those ROP gadgets away?

#54
post #35
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought openbsd did it after boot?

OpenBSD relinks sshd. Which is relatively small thing that is linked from relatively large objects (ie. it is the typical modern C code). Relinking thing like glibc on demand is going to be problematic, because it is structured as to allow small binary sizes for static linking and thus almost every function that is part of glibc API is a separate compilation unit and object file. Linking that into .so is slow, no mat…

doesn't matter how long it takes if you don't block the boot process doing it

you can link in the background at idle priority, and if you don't complete before reboot: no big deal

Re: Fun with Gentoo: Why don't we just shuffle those ROP gadgets away?

#55
post #54
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OpenBSD relinks sshd. Which is relatively small thing that is linked from relatively large objects (ie. it is the typical modern C code). Relinking thing like glibc on demand is going to be problematic, because it is structured as to allow small binary sizes for static linking and thus almost every function that is part of glibc API is a separate compilation unit and object file. Linking that into .so is slow, no mat…

doesn't matter how long it takes if you don't block the boot process doing it you can link in the background at idle priority, and if you don't complete before reboot: no big deal

Relinking glibc would block the boot process.

Re: Fun with Gentoo: Why don't we just shuffle those ROP gadgets away?

#57

I wonder if just shuffling it on every release (even minor) isn’t sufficient (and actually even publishing that order). That doesn’t have full security benefit (attackers have a finite set of options) but keeps reproducible builds and the ability to distribute pre-linked binaries while raising the attack complexity significantly since no two machines are likely running the exact same version. That means an exploit ha…

This is generally less useful with automatic updates for security patches because then you do want everyone to be running the same, latest, version.

Re: Fun with Gentoo: Why don't we just shuffle those ROP gadgets away?

#58
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

doesn't matter how long it takes if you don't block the boot process doing it you can link in the background at idle priority, and if you don't complete before reboot: no big deal

Relinking glibc would block the boot process.

how?

it's a dynamic library, and this isn't windoze with awful mandatory locking

as long as the underlying version is unchanged: there should be no problem whatsoever

Re: Fun with Gentoo: Why don't we just shuffle those ROP gadgets away?

#59
post #49
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why did I never think of printing it? I'd open it in lynx on a 2nd framebuffer (I forget the proper term... the things that were like Alt+Shift+an Fkey or something)

Console 8)

Virtual terminal
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