An incomplete guide to stealth addresses • Hacker News Board

Re: An incomplete guide to stealth addresses

#51

Post by mnd999 » Sun, Jan 22, 2023, 10:15 AM UTC

DennisP wrote: post #42

dmitriid wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Ukraine received a bunch of international crypto donations last year, for example. That they can surely use, right, right? Because all that crypto can be easily used for buying stuff, right? right? In reality it looks like those donations were laundered through an offshore exchange. Someone will always find ways to profit from war.

According to Ukrainian officials, yes, some of their military suppliers did in fact accept crypto directly, and it was quicker and easier than using the banking system. https://www.coindesk.com/policy/2022/03/07/ukraine-is-buying...

Arms dealers are pragmatists.

Re: An incomplete guide to stealth addresses

#52

Post by yieldcrv » Sun, Jan 22, 2023, 6:13 PM UTC

woodruffw wrote: post #28

yieldcrv wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think there are procedural issues not statutory ones. Procedure can undermine the statutory one, in this case there is a requirement for an entity to be able to argue on its own behalf to be removed from the sanctions list, this is not possible with the Tornado Cash contract addresses. There is also the issue of determining how it is a Foreign Asset to begin with. Is it based on the developer they identified? They…

This is an interesting point, but is it uniformly true? The OFAC list also includes aircraft and boats, which presumably can't argue on their own behalf.

The owner and organization can argue

Tornado Cash autonomous contracts cannot. They need to establish proof of who or what organization deployed it. I believe they skipped this step for incompetence or for needing it clarified in court

Re: An incomplete guide to stealth addresses

#53

Post by nobody9999 » Mon, Jan 23, 2023, 12:04 AM UTC

mhluongo wrote: post #23

nobody9999 wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Given the uses for crypto in practice, it's a safe bet that the majority of use will be for illegal activities. For the moment, that appears to be a good bet. I'm not aware of any current practical use case for cryptocurrency, that government-backed currencies don't provide, other than purchasing illegal goods and services. That said, government-backed currencies are also used for doing so as well, except cash trans…

Sending money is a pretty clear use case. Ukraine received a bunch of international crypto donations last year, for example. Your lack of imagination doesn't mean something is just for "illegal activities".

I explicitly said[0]:

"I'm not aware of any current practical use case for cryptocurrency, that government-backed currencies don't provide"

"that government-backed currencies don't provide." That's the important part which you ignored.

Sending money using established, government-backed currencies/ecosystems that you're not trying to hide from the government (for legal stuff, generally) is currently (note the adverb here) more secure and less risky than using cryptocurrencies to do so.

Is it poor reading comprehension your part, did you just not like what I said and so ignored it, or are you unable to process information if it contradicts your trained-in prejudices?

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34470711

Edit: Fixed prose to say what I wanted to say, not the opposite.

Re: An incomplete guide to stealth addresses

#54

Post by nobody9999 » Mon, Jan 23, 2023, 12:51 AM UTC

pcthrowaway wrote: post #35

mhluongo wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sending money is a pretty clear use case. Ukraine received a bunch of international crypto donations last year, for example. Your lack of imagination doesn't mean something is just for "illegal activities".

I actually think there are plenty of legitimate uses of cryptocurrency, and that it is being used in those ways today. But the Ukraine example is a strange one to me, only because I'm unclear on the legality of funding the war efforts of another country.

>I actually think there are plenty of legitimate uses of cryptocurrency, and that it is being used in those ways today.

Absolutely. I never said anything that contradicts that statement.

Rather, I pointed out that the majority of those legitimate use cases are currently better served with the global financial system. And as such, the current, practical* use cases for cryptocurrency are as a medium of exchange for goods and services that governments frown upon.

I make no judgement as to whether that's good or bad, just that it is.

I'll remind you that I said currently, not forever, not it's just a scam, not everyone who touches cryptocurrency is a criminal and most certainly not there are no legitimate uses for cryptocurrency; Just that currently the most compelling use case for cryptocurrency is as a medium of exchange for "illegal" goods and services.

Most (not all, I'm not being categorical here) other use cases are currently better served via the global financial ecosystem based on government-backed currencies.