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E-mail is the Universal Platform

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Re: E-mail is the Universal Platform

#51

Post by cstejerean »

chetan51 wrote: post #40
bane wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True, which is probably why google put im right next to the message viewer in gmail. I know of many ocassions where a flurry of emails turned into an im session. I think gmail's "conversations" are really the first try at what I'm talking about, a new front end on email, but I don't think they work well enough personally. And they haven't really expanded well on the concept recently.

Google Wave was really what I thought the ideal marriage between email and IM. Why did it fail again?

I believe it failed in part because of the slow rollout (nobody you cared about had access yet) and lack of interop with email for notifications about changes, etc. I tried using it, and gave up. By the time it became widely available most of the early adopters gave up as well.

Re: E-mail is the Universal Platform

#52

Post by nemoniac »

est wrote: post #46
bane wrote: post #33

I'm almost convinced at this point if somebody simply built a facebook like interface, and used email as the messaging protocol, but didn't display it like an email, more like a FB conversation (as opposed to a threaded or gmail-like conversation view), that it would be used. There's not really much that's offered by alternate messaging solutions that email can't do if it existing in the right sort of framework: 1) P…

> Why everybody seems to want to reinvent email is beyond me. 11) Program parsable structured info? UNCHECK How cool if emails have a semantic layer standard, like when someone invites you to an event using email, another app could automatically recognize datetime, convert time zones and add to a task reminder? (think of embedded iCal or vCard, but more generic and powerful).

Emails have a semantic layer standard. it handles iCal and vCard. And not only that, it's extensible. See mailcap and MIME.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mailcap http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MIME

Re: E-mail is the Universal Platform

#53

Post by mnutt »

chetan51 wrote: post #37
bane wrote: post #33

I'm almost convinced at this point if somebody simply built a facebook like interface, and used email as the messaging protocol, but didn't display it like an email, more like a FB conversation (as opposed to a threaded or gmail-like conversation view), that it would be used. There's not really much that's offered by alternate messaging solutions that email can't do if it existing in the right sort of framework: 1) P…

I agree with most of what you said, except that the real-time aspect is not real-time enough. If email were actually real-time, then it could completely replace instant messaging as well. Right now it's lacking.

Shameless self-promotion: my startup (http://movableink.com) lets you add real-time elements to email. In fact, we have a group messaging company using it to show real-time conversations in status emails.

It doesn't allow interactivity (which is what you're probably thinking of) but it does provide real-time content.

Re: E-mail is the Universal Platform

#54

Post by akrymski »

bane wrote: post #33

I'm almost convinced at this point if somebody simply built a facebook like interface, and used email as the messaging protocol, but didn't display it like an email, more like a FB conversation (as opposed to a threaded or gmail-like conversation view), that it would be used. There's not really much that's offered by alternate messaging solutions that email can't do if it existing in the right sort of framework: 1) P…

That is exactly what post.fm is all about. Check it out - we'd love for you to become a beta tester and perhaps pick your brain a bit ;)

Re: E-mail is the Universal Platform

#55

Post by akrymski »

chetan51 wrote: post #37
bane wrote: post #33

I'm almost convinced at this point if somebody simply built a facebook like interface, and used email as the messaging protocol, but didn't display it like an email, more like a FB conversation (as opposed to a threaded or gmail-like conversation view), that it would be used. There's not really much that's offered by alternate messaging solutions that email can't do if it existing in the right sort of framework: 1) P…

I agree with most of what you said, except that the real-time aspect is not real-time enough. If email were actually real-time, then it could completely replace instant messaging as well. Right now it's lacking.

It is real-time, it's just that current email clients aren't designed to be efficient, it's purely UI's fault. Again this is something we've fixed at post.fm, cant wait to show you guys.

Re: E-mail is the Universal Platform

#56

Post by akrymski »

blueplastic wrote: post #18

E-mail is so broken fundamentally, that it's not even funny. I'm surprised more people aren't trying to replace it. E-mail's based on the idea that it is free to message me and bother me and take a few precious seconds of my stream of consciousness. If it's free to email people, then of course spammers will flood email channels with their deals and scams. Ideally, I want a communications platform where only my 200 or…

Email is a collection of protocols stacked on top of each other, so when we're talking about replacing email you have to be specific about which part you'd like replaced. DNS? SMTP layer? IMAP layer? application / email client layer? spam filtering layer?

What you're suggesting is indeed something that can be,and will be, added to email. But there's nothing wrong in email at a lower level (SMTP say) thats preventing someone from setting this up. One thing that definitely sucks is IMAP though, would love to see that replaced by a restful protocol. But we have no alternative to a ubiquitous distributed and open messaging system that is SMTP.

Re: E-mail is the Universal Platform

#57

Post by chetan51 »

akrymski wrote: post #55
chetan51 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with most of what you said, except that the real-time aspect is not real-time enough. If email were actually real-time, then it could completely replace instant messaging as well. Right now it's lacking.

It is real-time, it's just that current email clients aren't designed to be efficient, it's purely UI's fault. Again this is something we've fixed at post.fm, cant wait to show you guys.

Is the protocol actually as real-time as XMPP is?

Re: E-mail is the Universal Platform

#58

Post by akrymski »

chetan51 wrote: post #57
akrymski wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is real-time, it's just that current email clients aren't designed to be efficient, it's purely UI's fault. Again this is something we've fixed at post.fm, cant wait to show you guys.

Is the protocol actually as real-time as XMPP is?

Obviously email doesn't support seeing someone type, but SMTP is almost as fast as XMPP - sub 1 second doesn't really make a difference, it's usually IMAP that's the slow bit. Of course it's just as fast as XMPP if both sender and recipient are using post.fm, but the real latency comes from the recipient using eg gmail which has really slow IMAP polling in the web client (plus having to go back to the inbox or clicking show new message in gmail). Post.fm doesn't use IMAP under the hood so its instantaneous (and querying your mail in SQL lets us do amazing stuff).

Re: E-mail is the Universal Platform

#59

Post by chetan51 »

akrymski wrote: post #58
chetan51 wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the protocol actually as real-time as XMPP is?

Obviously email doesn't support seeing someone type, but SMTP is almost as fast as XMPP - sub 1 second doesn't really make a difference, it's usually IMAP that's the slow bit. Of course it's just as fast as XMPP if both sender and recipient are using post.fm, but the real latency comes from the recipient using eg gmail which has really slow IMAP polling in the web client (plus having to go back to the inbox or clicki…

What is post.fm? Do you have a demo yet? I'd love to see it.

Re: E-mail is the Universal Platform

#60

Post by akrymski »

chetan51 wrote: post #59
akrymski wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obviously email doesn't support seeing someone type, but SMTP is almost as fast as XMPP - sub 1 second doesn't really make a difference, it's usually IMAP that's the slow bit. Of course it's just as fast as XMPP if both sender and recipient are using post.fm, but the real latency comes from the recipient using eg gmail which has really slow IMAP polling in the web client (plus having to go back to the inbox or clicki…

What is post.fm? Do you have a demo yet? I'd love to see it.

its a new email platform to rival gmail, but we're stealth still so i cant disclose much. we'll be starting a beta pretty soon and issue an official press release at that stage - make sure you request an invite in the meantime.
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