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Are super-rich people just better at making money?

pudding.cool

51–60 of 587 posts

Re: Are super-rich people just better at making money?

#51

This combines with the observation that intelligence is normally distributed, so the rich people are more likely to be average people that got lucky, because there's more of them than smart people with a good strategy. It also applies in the opposite direction, there's more unlucky average people than true failures.

That doesn't seem to follow, unless intelligence and ability to make money are mostly uncorrelated, which I think is a very strong claim that needs to be substantiated.

Re: Are super-rich people just better at making money?

#52
post #14
post #3

To solve all this, it's pretty simple, and the U.S. actually used to do it: heavily tax the super rich. Heavy taxation and then appropriate use of those funds for education, R&D funding, infrastructure, etc. is actual trickle-down economics. And mega corporations should be heavily taxed instead of holding the country economically hostage. They jumpstart their companies off of government funding and R&D and then act a…

The US is only very loosely constrained by its tax base. It does not lack funds. It has also been spending much more on education over the past decades[1]. With very little to show for it. [1] https://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d19/tables/dt19_236.55.a...

Because spending money on education doesn't equate to better outcomes. It creates more bureaucracy, bigger councils, etc.

Teacher pay is still abysmal, especially considering the fact they are expected to act as guardians and even security these days. And you'll never get better outcomes if you can't attract smart people to actually teach, no matter how much you pay the superintendent.

US public education should be called what it is, a government sponsored day care.

Re: Are super-rich people just better at making money?

#53
post #3

To solve all this, it's pretty simple, and the U.S. actually used to do it: heavily tax the super rich. Heavy taxation and then appropriate use of those funds for education, R&D funding, infrastructure, etc. is actual trickle-down economics. And mega corporations should be heavily taxed instead of holding the country economically hostage. They jumpstart their companies off of government funding and R&D and then act a…

One thing I've noticed consistently, is when politicians talk about "taxing the wealthy", they almost always follow that with "earning more than $xxxk a year". This is conflating wealth with income. Being within this tax bracket myself, I do not deny that I am biased, but I do hope this bullshit gets called out hard whenever someone brings up yet another underhanded measure to milk us (typical SFBay SWE) above and be…

They want as many voters as possible to feel that they won't be among those who will be taxed. You're in the minority.

Re: Are super-rich people just better at making money?

#54
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But tell me, how are you going to tax the super rich? It's incredibly difficult to tax someone who's actually poor on paper. Most super rich people actually don't seem to have much wealth officially declared, all of their wealth is sort of like "pseudo" in that it's all tied up in assets, and sometimes assets that aren't directly owned by them but their companies etc. and they have a lot of shortcuts for tax breaks o…

> It's incredibly difficult to tax someone who's actually poor on paper You think this because the super rich want you to think this. Actually, it's not hard and there are some good ideas floating around (e.g. more inheritance tax, don't let them get loans without taxes againt their illiquid wealth). Does it require a change of laws? Yes, but that's the whole point of democracy.

> more inheritance tax

won't fix anything

> don't let them get loans without taxes againt their illiquid wealth

You don't want to fix this. It would kill repurchasing agreements as a collateral damage, making access to credit more difficult and expensive for everyone. Not to mention HELOCs. You might say, "ok, exempt HELOCs", but that's just an arbitrary goalpost.

The economy is organic, you can just use a wrench and have a go at a couple of cogs and expect there to be no knock-on effect.

Re: Are super-rich people just better at making money?

#55
post #14
post #3

To solve all this, it's pretty simple, and the U.S. actually used to do it: heavily tax the super rich. Heavy taxation and then appropriate use of those funds for education, R&D funding, infrastructure, etc. is actual trickle-down economics. And mega corporations should be heavily taxed instead of holding the country economically hostage. They jumpstart their companies off of government funding and R&D and then act a…

The US is only very loosely constrained by its tax base. It does not lack funds. It has also been spending much more on education over the past decades[1]. With very little to show for it. [1] https://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d19/tables/dt19_236.55.a...

My partner is a teacher, and the money certainly does not reach educators or kids in need. It mostly gets stuck at the administrative level or is spent for expensive football teams. Hell, there is still a national debate about kids going into debt to pay for lunch

Re: Are super-rich people just better at making money?

#57
post #3

To solve all this, it's pretty simple, and the U.S. actually used to do it: heavily tax the super rich. Heavy taxation and then appropriate use of those funds for education, R&D funding, infrastructure, etc. is actual trickle-down economics. And mega corporations should be heavily taxed instead of holding the country economically hostage. They jumpstart their companies off of government funding and R&D and then act a…

But tell me, how are you going to tax the super rich? It's incredibly difficult to tax someone who's actually poor on paper. Most super rich people actually don't seem to have much wealth officially declared, all of their wealth is sort of like "pseudo" in that it's all tied up in assets, and sometimes assets that aren't directly owned by them but their companies etc. and they have a lot of shortcuts for tax breaks o…

You tax capital gains, interest income, dividends, royalties etc etc etc exactly the same as income from labor is taxed.

Re: Are super-rich people just better at making money?

#58
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But tell me, how are you going to tax the super rich? It's incredibly difficult to tax someone who's actually poor on paper. Most super rich people actually don't seem to have much wealth officially declared, all of their wealth is sort of like "pseudo" in that it's all tied up in assets, and sometimes assets that aren't directly owned by them but their companies etc. and they have a lot of shortcuts for tax breaks o…

Of course you can track down de facto ownership and streams of income regardless of de jure separation. This is a question of political will, not economical (im)possibilities. Whenever you try making rich people responsible, they move abroad. In Norway, the super rich are becoming Swiss citizens after a recent change in taxation. Unless Switzerland takes social responsibility, they're getting away with it. But if Swi…

What's wrong with saying good riddance to the super rich moving abroad? I'm tired of these threats of the rich and corporations saying they'll just go elsewhere. I say go for it and call their bluff.

They still need to interact with developed countries economic systems, so still punish them there.

Re: Are super-rich people just better at making money?

#59
Well… except that many super rich had failed businesses, went bankrupt etc?

I used to kinda think along the lines of this post. However, when examining the performance of top investors for example (eg Buffet, Templeton, Marks etc) it is clear it isn’t mainly luck.

Re: Are super-rich people just better at making money?

#60
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's incredibly difficult to tax someone who's actually poor on paper You think this because the super rich want you to think this. Actually, it's not hard and there are some good ideas floating around (e.g. more inheritance tax, don't let them get loans without taxes againt their illiquid wealth). Does it require a change of laws? Yes, but that's the whole point of democracy.

> more inheritance tax won't fix anything > don't let them get loans without taxes againt their illiquid wealth You don't want to fix this. It would kill repurchasing agreements as a collateral damage, making access to credit more difficult and expensive for everyone. Not to mention HELOCs. You might say, "ok, exempt HELOCs", but that's just an arbitrary goalpost. The economy is organic, you can just use a wrench and…

> The economy is organic, you can just use a wrench and have a go at a couple of cogs and expect there to be no knock-on effect.

What do you even mean by "organic"? Of course governments can, do and should intervene in the economy. And yes, there should be a range of experts evaluating policies before they are encated. I never stated the opposite.

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