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Iranian Officials Asking Venezuela for Asylum in Case of Regime Change

iranintl.com

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Re: Iranian Officials Asking Venezuela for Asylum in Case of Regime Change

#51

Post by another2another »

greggarious wrote: post #6
themitigating wrote: post #2

It's so weird to me how rare it is that the leaders of countries are executed by the population and to even call for that upsets people regardless of what their reign is like. There's almost no incentive to be a good leader since if it all falls apart you'll just end up living luxuriously in another country. Why is there such a high value placed on human life that ignores the impact that person had upon the world? Fe…

Someone told me in a bar on K Street the thing Vladimir Putin fears most is being hung from a gas station like Mussolinu, and I suspect that goes for all totalitarians. What scares me is I've met people like that at home in the USA. There is a quote by a KGB defector which I lost the cite for. "There is nowhere to defect to." They can live in luxury, but you cannot buy respect. Folks are allowed to show you, in small…

I also heard somewhere (also don't have link), that he apparently watched in horror the killing of Gaddafi multiple times, possibly imagining himself in the same situation.

I wonder if there's a deepfake of that video with Putin's face instead of Gaddafi's - that would certainly freak him out :)

Re: Iranian Officials Asking Venezuela for Asylum in Case of Regime Change

#52

Post by myth_drannon »

I see exactly the same news going around Ukrainian telegram channels about Putin. First they thought China and now they are buying real estate in Venezuaela and Argentina. Some say it's fake and some not. I tend to believe it's fake news to show the regime is weak and is loosing.

Re: Iranian Officials Asking Venezuela for Asylum in Case of Regime Change

#53

Post by themitigating »

rich_sasha wrote: post #42
themitigating wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But they don't tend to give up power that easily right? Also if there is some sort revolution how would they stay in power? Either the military supports them in which their potential fate doesn't matter or they have no way to protect themselves.

NK leaders probably know there is no way out, so also nothing to lose. Iran, for example, is less bad I guess than North Korea.

So if China refuses to grant them exile they will tell the army to attack people randomly or to detonate a nuclear bomb? How many would follow this order?

Re: Iranian Officials Asking Venezuela for Asylum in Case of Regime Change

#54

Post by themitigating »

gizmo686 wrote: post #8
themitigating wrote: post #2

It's so weird to me how rare it is that the leaders of countries are executed by the population and to even call for that upsets people regardless of what their reign is like. There's almost no incentive to be a good leader since if it all falls apart you'll just end up living luxuriously in another country. Why is there such a high value placed on human life that ignores the impact that person had upon the world? Fe…

You want leaders to be able to give up. If staying in power is the only thing seperating a leader from the angry mob, they will fight the hopeless fight until the bitter end. If they have the option if fleeing to another country, then at some point they could decide its in their best interest to just give up.

Hopeless fight how? Personally? Because I don't think the army won't stand with them forever.

Re: Iranian Officials Asking Venezuela for Asylum in Case of Regime Change

#55

Post by Alir3z4 »

greggarious wrote: post #3

Huh? Is... Venezuela... particularly Islamic? Maybe Kosovo would be a better cultural fit.

LoL, I don't think Iranians officials want to apply asylum in there anywhere near Albania, the quota is already taken by Mojahedin-e-Khalq (MEK) (hint: terrorists org/cult)

Re: Iranian Officials Asking Venezuela for Asylum in Case of Regime Change

#57

Post by dotnet00 »

greggarious wrote: post #14
keewee7 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kosovo-Albanians (and Ukrainians) are probably the most pro-American people in the world right now. Just because Kosovo is Muslim-majority does not mean they're friendly to the Iranian regime.

I'm sorry, I wasn't saying they wanted them. I was just saying it's weird to me if someone claims to want an Islamic Republic to move to a secular place rather than, say, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, or the UAE. Sorry -- I didn't mean to insult folks from Kosovo or Albania. (I'm not a nationalist, I just utilize the existing neoliberal laws and norms to move us to something more respectful of personal autonomy while respecti…

That sort of hypocrisy is pretty common for totalitarian regimes regardless of religious affiliation, the children of their high ranking leaders often spend most of their life enjoying the luxuries of liberal societies.

That said, Saudi Arabia, Qatar and the UAE are especially problematic for Iranian leaders because Iran's official sect of Islam is opposed to that of those countries.

Re: Iranian Officials Asking Venezuela for Asylum in Case of Regime Change

#58

Post by ch4s3 »

esperent wrote: post #26
tokai wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>to even call for that upsets people regardless of what their reign is like. Its was so weird when Gaddafi was killed. He was a murderous villain and the west had directly made sure that his regime would fall or even outright tried to kill him with bombings. But when some of his so-called subjects got their hands on him and finished the job it was much maligned in the press. For some reason the more power you have th…

I think this aligns with the common and infuriating Western media trope where the hero can kill any number of low level unidentified grunts but as soon as they come to the big boss guy they suddenly get morals and have to let him live. All the pain and suffering caused by Gaddafi happened off screen to unidentified people so we were silent. His killing happened very much on screen to a recognizable "bad guy" so sudde…

I think people is "the west" wanted to see him tried in a court rather than impaled and summarily shot. The whole Western bombing campaign happened specifically because Gaddafi was waging war on the civilian population.

Re: Iranian Officials Asking Venezuela for Asylum in Case of Regime Change

#59

Post by fcatalan »

greggarious wrote: post #14
keewee7 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kosovo-Albanians (and Ukrainians) are probably the most pro-American people in the world right now. Just because Kosovo is Muslim-majority does not mean they're friendly to the Iranian regime.

I'm sorry, I wasn't saying they wanted them. I was just saying it's weird to me if someone claims to want an Islamic Republic to move to a secular place rather than, say, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, or the UAE. Sorry -- I didn't mean to insult folks from Kosovo or Albania. (I'm not a nationalist, I just utilize the existing neoliberal laws and norms to move us to something more respectful of personal autonomy while respecti…

A secular place won't execute them on the spot, but their sworn enemies for 1500 years would most probably do.

Re: Iranian Officials Asking Venezuela for Asylum in Case of Regime Change

#60

Post by luckylion »

schubart wrote: post #30
luckylion wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The idea is that if the leader can live luxuriously in another country, they have an incentive to stop being a bad leader and retire in luxury already. That sounds plausible, but does it actually happen? I mean, tyrants have certainly fled the country to live somewhere else and retire their ambitions, but have they ever done so peacefully?

Former East German leader Erich Honecker [1] lived in Chile until he died of cancer. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erich_Honecker

I don't think he was threatened, Germans are far too nice to take revenge on their dictators (and he probably also doesn't quite fit the 'dictator' model this is aimed at, as I'm not aware of him having funneled large sums of money out of the country; he was a dictator because of ideology, not because he was a power-hungry cleptocrat, and he resigned before the government folded). He could've lived in Germany, his trial was abandoned, but chose Chile to join his family who had emigrated when he asked for asylum.
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