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AP fires reporter behind retracted ‘Russian missiles’ story

thedailybeast.com

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Re: AP fires reporter behind retracted ‘Russian missiles’ story

#51

Post by piva00 »

throwawaymedia wrote: post #33

When Ukraine hits Poland (even by mistake), people take step back and blame Russia, because Ukraine wouldn't have had to use an anti-missile system if there was no Russian missile in the first place. Fair enough. Now, why don't people use the same analogy for Russia starting that war? Let's take a step back and ask a basic question - who escalated this all? Who benefits from this war? Who pours money there? Why is no…

> Now, why don't people use the same analogy for Russia starting that war?

Because a war of invasion and annexation is something we've learned since WW2 that won't ever be tolerated in Europe again, history has shown why.

> Let's take a step back and ask a basic question - who escalated this all?

Pretty easy: Putin and Russia. First 2008, then 2014 and a full-scale invasion in 2022. Russia chose to invade a neighbouring country in 2008 (Georgia, hope you remember it), Russia decided to escalate that and annex Crimea in 2014. Russia shadow-invaded Ukraine in 2014 (or have you forgotten all the military personnel wearing Russian gear that went "on vacation" to Donbass and Crimea?). Russia downed a civilian airplane in 2014.

Or isn't any of that escalation?

> Who benefits from this war?

Very good question, if the war ended in 3 days as it was Putin's fantasy who would have benefited from this war?

As it didn't end in 3 days, no one is really benefiting from this except the military industry in multiple countries, mostly in Europe, which didn't have to arm themselves for decades of relative peace.

> Who pours money there?

All the Western countries are pouring money in there, to fend off an invasion, to keep the sovereignty of a state, a thing that wasn't really required to be taken care of since the end of WW2.

> Why is nobody asking these questions?

Because they are fucking dumb questions posed by Russian propaganda, that's why.

Re: AP fires reporter behind retracted ‘Russian missiles’ story

#52

Post by andrewflnr »

kodyo wrote: post #43
ajross wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What agenda? The state department and white house straight up denied this story when it ran!

Quoted post unavailable.

I'm pretty sure that's just so they don't feel like they have to go all Article 5 on Ukraine. That would be really awkward, going to war against a country you were donating arms to yesterday, right? So sure, there's an agenda, but it seems like a morally defensible one, and not one supported by lies (at least not where it intersects with US interests).

Re: AP fires reporter behind retracted ‘Russian missiles’ story

#54

Post by piva00 »

kodyo wrote: post #39
elevaet wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what's your point? Should we join hands and welcome Russia to help themselves in Ukraine? This whataboutism around Ukraine is emblematic of the problem with misaligned postmodern thinking. The fact of the matter is that Russia has violently invaded Ukraine and they are trying to bend Ukraine against its will. It's wrong and the world _should_ come to their side. Likewise if the tables were turned.

Funny thing is that the tables WERE turned, by NATO.

How, exactly?

Re: AP fires reporter behind retracted ‘Russian missiles’ story

#55

Post by throwawaymedia »

piva00 wrote: post #51
throwawaymedia wrote: post #33

When Ukraine hits Poland (even by mistake), people take step back and blame Russia, because Ukraine wouldn't have had to use an anti-missile system if there was no Russian missile in the first place. Fair enough. Now, why don't people use the same analogy for Russia starting that war? Let's take a step back and ask a basic question - who escalated this all? Who benefits from this war? Who pours money there? Why is no…

> Now, why don't people use the same analogy for Russia starting that war? Because a war of invasion and annexation is something we've learned since WW2 that won't ever be tolerated in Europe again, history has shown why. > Let's take a step back and ask a basic question - who escalated this all? Pretty easy: Putin and Russia. First 2008, then 2014 and a full-scale invasion in 2022. Russia chose to invade a neighbour…

Ok, smarty. Why was there a conflict in Georgia? What were the events that led to it?

> Russia decided to escalate that and annex Crimea in 2014

Putin CLEARLY said that he will annex Crimea if X. What is that X?

Re: AP fires reporter behind retracted ‘Russian missiles’ story

#56

Post by kodyo »

kube-system wrote: post #49
kodyo wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

It’s not 2014 anymore. If you think that a coup is wrong, then what do you think about a total annexation?

That both are abhorrent but we wouldn’t be where we are today if NATO hadn’t been extending its membership eastwards since the end of the cold war and running arms deals with countries on Russia’s border.

Re: AP fires reporter behind retracted ‘Russian missiles’ story

#57

Post by kube-system »

kodyo wrote: post #43
ajross wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What agenda? The state department and white house straight up denied this story when it ran!

Quoted post unavailable.

If Russia was not firing missiles at Ukrainian cities, Ukraine would not be firing their defense systems.

Re: AP fires reporter behind retracted ‘Russian missiles’ story

#58

Post by kube-system »

kodyo wrote: post #56
kube-system wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not 2014 anymore. If you think that a coup is wrong, then what do you think about a total annexation?

That both are abhorrent but we wouldn’t be where we are today if NATO hadn’t been extending its membership eastwards since the end of the cold war and running arms deals with countries on Russia’s border.

As if the mere thought of Ukraine joining an alliance, which they didn’t even join, is justification to start firing missiles?

Re: AP fires reporter behind retracted ‘Russian missiles’ story

#59

Post by [deleted] »

defrost wrote: post #46
somenameforme wrote: post #16

It's amazing how quickly fake news is able to spread through "credible" news sources, all without even the slightest bit of real verification. I don't know if its scary or comforting to consider that if the political establishment wanted WW3, they could have it had it right there. The same intelligence agencies that convinced the world Iraq had WMD could have simply agreed with the story/Zelensky/et al, declare anybo…

> The same intelligence agencies that convinced the world Iraq had WMD To be more accurate about something that matters, no intelligence agency in the US, the UK, AU, or other major intell nation claimed that Iraq had WMD's. That was completely and utterly a senior US political position that demanded non existeant evidence to support a bizarro "known unknowns" claim .. backed by then UK politicians and tacitly agreed…

[deleted]

Re: AP fires reporter behind retracted ‘Russian missiles’ story

#60

Post by piva00 »

throwawaymedia wrote: post #55
piva00 wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Now, why don't people use the same analogy for Russia starting that war? Because a war of invasion and annexation is something we've learned since WW2 that won't ever be tolerated in Europe again, history has shown why. > Let's take a step back and ask a basic question - who escalated this all? Pretty easy: Putin and Russia. First 2008, then 2014 and a full-scale invasion in 2022. Russia chose to invade a neighbour…

Ok, smarty. Why was there a conflict in Georgia? What were the events that led to it? > Russia decided to escalate that and annex Crimea in 2014 Putin CLEARLY said that he will annex Crimea if X. What is that X?

If you want to expand on your points, please be clear and expand on them. Asking me to answer rhetorical questions as some kind of bizarre argumentation mechanism is tiresome and clearly against the kind of discussions I expect to be fostered on Hacker News.

Either do your own work and expand your argumentation so myself and others can properly reply or stop with this bullshit, it's boring to have to interact with this.

Also, by the guidelines, use emphasis like this, ALL CAPS is frowned upon on this forum. Thank you very much.

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